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Curtis Yarvin on how "the Left" has executed population replacement in the White Dominions as a "stalk and charge." "This is a predator... [and] they're starting to speed run...mass immigration is not 2 million people entering the US a year...[it's] 10... to 100 million a year" This clip of... show more
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![Just in $AMD Anush "Speed is the moat"|ROCm🎙️ In the race to define the future of AI, what's the one advantage that truly lasts? It's not proprietary tech, argues Anush Elangovan Elangovan, VP of AI Software at AMD , but the sustainable speed of innovation. He explains why AMD is rejecting the "walled garden" model for its open source ROCm stack, betting that an open community flywheel is the key to victory. Listen to understand how this open strategy is designed to out-innovate closed systems by empowering developers to solve everything from frontier-model challenges to the mundane, everyday problems that define the "last mile" of AI. AMD ROCm Software: Part 1 Transcript [00:00:00] Andrew Zigler: Joining me is Anush Elangovan, VP of AI software at AMD. And when people talk about AI compute, the conversation often stops at hardware specs, but it's more than just physical chips that win the game. It's also the software ecosystems supporting them. [00:00:18] Andrew Zigler: The prevailing strategy in the industry has been to build something like a walled garden. You know, something closed, proprietary locks, developers in. But AMD is betting on an entirely different play, open source acceleration, and with rock, their open source AI software stack. AMD is building not just hardware parity, but an innovation flywheel that's powered by the community with interoperability and the freedom to scale without all of that pesky lockin. [00:00:48] Andrew Zigler: And in this world, speed is your moat and how fast you can innovate while your platform remains open, flexible, and standardize across all of its applications. That's what we're gonna explore [00:01:00] today. So Anush, I'm really excited to have you here. Welcome to Dev Interrupted. [00:01:04] Anush Elangovan: Thanks for having me. Uh, super excited to chat about it. [00:01:07] Andrew Zigler: Amazing. Well, let's go ahead and dive right in with kind of what I laid it out with in the beginning, the idea of the moat and it being about speed. I wanna unpack that a bit because that came from you when you and I first spoke. And I, and I want to know, you know, how do you define speed inside of AMD beyond just things like hardware, benchmarks. [00:01:27] Anush Elangovan: Yeah, that's a very good question. So when we typically talk about speed, everyone's like, Hey, hardware benchmark specs, right? Like, uh, memory bandwidth or, or flops. And that is one important part of it, uh, AMD does very well. With that, we do have, a, a very good history of executing on that axis. [00:01:47] Anush Elangovan: But when I say speed is the moat, it is about, uh, how we prepare, how we build the muscle to run the race for a long time and run it fast. And it is [00:02:00] not about a single point in time that you've, you've beat some you know, benchmark and, and you declare victory. It's about building the ability to consistently develop and deliver. [00:02:13] Anush Elangovan: Both hardware and software innovation at scale and do it fast, right? Like, you know, we we're increasingly getting to a point where models come out and they're, uh, you know, a year or two ago it was like, Hey, they work on AMD on day zero, which is great, but now they are performing on AMD the day it releases, right? [00:02:32] Anush Elangovan: So, what does it take to Prefetch where the industry is going? Be prepared to intercept. At that point is what you know, I, I refer to as you know, the, the speed factor in, in creating this mode, right? And the mode is just shed all things that hold you back and run as fast as you can. [00:02:53] Anush Elangovan: Uh, because the pace of innovation that is, uh, being seen in, in AI [00:03:00] industries is just. Amazing. Right? And it's like, it's transformational at at how you generate electricity. It's transformational as at how you build data centers. It's transformational at how you deploy compute, networking. It's transformational at what kind of use cases you, you know, uh, use AI for. [00:03:17] Anush Elangovan: Uh, and for that, you need to be prepared to, see what comes tomorrow and be prepared to run the race tomorrow. [00:03:23] Andrew Zigler: Yeah, it's a really great perspective because it highlights that it's not just like a checkpoint that you run through. I like how you called out, like it's not just hitting that benchmark or being the best in class at that moment, in that snapshot, it's about having a. The throughput and about having that dedication to the idea and continuing to deliver on it. [00:03:43] Andrew Zigler: It's not just crossing the threshold, but it's also being the engine. And that's what, that's what protects a business. That is the moat, because the moat is that innovation layer, the faster and more, uh, future forward. That you can work and think, [00:04:00] you know, the better. Uh, we, we talk a lot about like future forward work styles. [00:04:04] Andrew Zigler: Like what are the things I could be doing right now today that are gonna be like, way more useful tomorrow? Let, let's abandon those, workflows that are older and that kind of like, that translates into. An advantage when you work that way. You know, what kind of things have you learned working with, uh, like across all spectrums of people who would use ROCm, right? [00:04:23] Andrew Zigler: You have like the developers, but then you also have the enterprises and you have this large span of adoptees, right? So what is the, what does that look like that you learn? [00:04:32] Anush Elangovan: Yeah, so, so the way I look at it is there are gonna be pockets of different, uh, you know, cadences, right? Like, so people who are deploying in enterprises, for example, right? The validation and how long it takes for them to deploy an LLM that's secure. It's, with guardrails, et cetera, maybe longer. [00:04:52] Anush Elangovan: but you still have to go through the process and you have to be prepared to like, walk that walk to deploy an enterprises. That doesn't mean it's [00:05:00] not fast, that's as fast as you can do for that industry, right? And if you are deploying AI in healthcare, right, it's, it's got its own, uh, cycle. [00:05:07] Anush Elangovan: but in each one of these, you want to see how, like, go down to the essence of what is it that you actually have to do. And, you know, I, I, I like how you framed it. It's like it's, you shed your prior assumptions of how things are done, right. And, and you kind of build up from a, uh, first principles, uh, approach to say, this is how I could use AI to unlock, whatever I'm doing. [00:05:33] Anush Elangovan: And, and, some of it, you know, it's good to really step back and look at. Just question every part of it, right? Like right now you're getting chat GPT and, Gemini competing for like, math, olympiads and, and, uh, college, uh, reasoning, uh, tests. Right? And, and those are like that, that is amazing and increasingly like complex tasks that they're trying to do. [00:05:58] Anush Elangovan: But there may also be like. [00:06:00] More mundane things that AI could, could get applied to. Right? And, and so when we think about shedding old ways, you wanna shed it not just in like the tip of the spear. It's like, you know, I'm gonna see what's the frontier model. It's also, it could be something as simple as. [00:06:18] Anush Elangovan: How do you choose a, a movie, uh, you know, like a recommendation system, right? Or, or, uh, an automated, uh, flight, uh, rebooking system. So the moment, you know, your flight is late, uh, right now it's a notification, right? It's like, oh, you got a text message saying your flight's late. And I got that like three times this week. [00:06:38] Anush Elangovan: But anyway, uh, and, and, and, and, I was just like, okay, so if I were to rethink this. All this MCPs that we have that should be hooked up into an MCP that says, your flight's delayed. Here are your options. If you want, you know, these are the paid options. Yeah. Here are the free options. This will get you back into your you know, Toronto airport [00:07:00] tonight. [00:07:00] Anush Elangovan: Or if you stay, here's a hotel plus this, plus this, plus. It's just like, go ahead is all I should say. Versus now I'm like, okay, can someone, you know, can I call a travel agent? Can I do this? Can I go online and log into And you know, so we gotta fundamentally rethink even those like small, nuances of, things that we do that can be automated out and AI is really, really good at doing something like this, right? Maybe I just explained an AI startup idea right now. Somebody should just start that. [00:07:29] Andrew Zigler: I think you did. Yeah, you definitely did. Someone, one of our listeners is definitely going to lift that off of you. I, I, I, you know, I hate being on the receiving end of those. You feel a little helpless and then you have to like, follow the whole flow. So I know what you mean. Like I, I like how you called out that the build and this like. [00:07:45] Andrew Zigler: Where speed is your moat and the innovation layer is protecting you, is what makes you better than your competitors. How you scale that and you bring that to market. So by understanding the problems that you're solving, uh, throwing away those older assumptions, but also [00:08:00] recognizing that like. We're building every single day, new things and new ways of using stuff that we're still figuring out the implications of. [00:08:08] Andrew Zigler: And so when you have a lot of velocity and you're introducing a lot of new ideas, and maybe you have that workflow now that automatically rebook your flight off of your late flight text message, and uh, I know I would certainly use it, but you know, what kind of philosophies guide the way that y'all think about building this ecosystem to manage that stability while letting folks. [00:08:29] Andrew Zigler: Play with the speed and the assumptions and the airplane re bookings. [00:08:34] Anush Elangovan: so, so I think, you know, we need to peel one layer down, right? and the philosophy is, Hey, we, we just discovered electricity, right? And you know what we're gonna do? We are gonna make motors, uh, or dynamos, right? Like engines. Uh, sure. We don't know if it's gonna be a Ferrari that you're gonna make, or it's a a a a dump truck. [00:08:57] Anush Elangovan: That's good for doing this. But let's [00:09:00] let, which is also required, right? You need a dump truck. You need a garbage truck. And, [00:09:04] Andrew Zigler: Yeah. You need the [00:09:04] Anush Elangovan: course you need, uh, a Ferrari for a midlife crisis, right? So, [00:09:09] Andrew Zigler: precisely. [00:09:10] Anush Elangovan: But, but my, uh, point is what do we build next? And, uh, and this is what I meant by like, okay, let's, let's take those baby steps to build the. [00:09:20] Anush Elangovan: Infrastructure that's required that we know we'll have to use, right? So, so if I just discovered electricity, okay, great. Now one, how do I save this electricity and how do I use it? So there's battery technology, so you need to do something like that, right? Like so. But then you also want to make it into an actionable thing. [00:09:37] Anush Elangovan: You want to make it for like automobiles, or you wanna use it for, you know, powering, uh, entire cities. So it is that transformational. So, uh, AI is that transformational. So, if you distill down, it'll, it'll come down to how do we think about, what we can do with this this fundamental technology that, We may not be aware of what it [00:10:00] is gonna unlock next, but at least you know the next step is clear, right? It's like a dense fog, you know, it's gonna be like, it, it's the right path. You see the light, but it's kind of like out there and, and the steps you're taking are concrete and you're like, okay, this is good. [00:10:16] Anush Elangovan: I, this is better than where I was or where we were. So we are moving forward. So you can build with the. Intuition from what you see in the short term and a tactical view, but towards what you think the future is gonna be. [00:10:28] Andrew Zigler: Right. You almost like we're all in this like fog of war, right? And like you said, you're reaching out and you're trying to step through it. You could think of it too, as like you're in the dark and your hands are up in front of you and you know that. You're, you're not gonna run your face into a wall because your hands are out in front of you, but you're not gonna maybe do much better than that. [00:10:45] Andrew Zigler: So that's kind of like, I think the eco, the, the industry, the world that we find ourselves in, uh, and we all have to, then this becomes the power of an ecosystem, of a group of people working together to create that layer of, [00:11:00] uh, of establishing the [00:11:01] Anush Elangovan: exactly. And I, I, I just, instead of, you know, saying fog of war I describe it as like, you're in this. Beautiful valley with like a morning, uh, fog that's in. You can smell the flowers. You, you hear the birds. You are like, okay, it's, we are in like, uh, utopian paradise and yes, I just need to like, continue the walk, right? [00:11:24] Anush Elangovan: and then move forward with that, conviction that you're in the right spot. [00:11:27] Andrew Zigler: Yeah. So let's talk about that ecosystem world. This nice, I love how you describe it, this grassy side of a hill in the morning that's covered in some mist and maybe we can't see 30 feet in one direction, but it sure is a beautiful hill and it smells nice. And so we're all here. And why is, in that world, why is. [00:11:44] Andrew Zigler: You know, open source, their strategic advantage that y'all are going for in the AI hardware market. And, and then how does like ROCm turn that into wins for people within that ecosystem? [00:11:56] Anush Elangovan: you know, the, the way we look at it is this, is kind of like how I view [00:12:00] AI and the ecosystem, right? But, but it is for everyone to enjoy. Uh, and so we do want to make sure that. You know, it is, uh, beneficial for everyone. [00:12:09] Anush Elangovan: The ecosystem can come in and, and innovate. It's an open innovation engine. and uh, it is very different from, you know, having a walled garden with, Hey, only I know how to do this and I'm gonna do it and throw it over the fence and you can use it or keep walking, right? So we'd like to be good citizens that way, but also. [00:12:30] Anush Elangovan: Uh, it is self-fulfilling in a way, right? Like it, the, the pace at which we innovate with open source is unmatched. Like, you know, our serving engines are like VLLM and, and sg l. Those things, uh, those frameworks are like super, super aggressive in terms of how fast they come out with features and how fast they can you know, get performant models out. [00:12:52] Anush Elangovan: And that compared with what, uh, you'd get from, you know, the likes of like T-R-T-L-L-M or something is always lagging, right? Because you [00:13:00] just can't keep up with you know, 200 commits a week just on one particular model to get that model really performant [00:13:06] Andrew Zigler: And, and, and in that world where, you know, everyone can enjoy the winds of this, what kind of customer stories or innovation stories have really stood out to you and excite you about building and creating this place for developers? [00:13:19] Anush Elangovan: Yeah. So I think the parts that are super exciting for me are when when we get to see a customer that is first skeptical. Then they start a little like, okay, fine, we'll give you a chance. Uh, we do a simple, uh, POC and then they're like, huh, this seems to work. Yeah, we told you it works. [00:13:42] Anush Elangovan: You don't have to change one line of code. Really? Yes, no need to change one line of code. Okay, let's try a production workload. So then they try it. Oh, you're more performant than the competition. Yes. We're more performant than, than the competition. So how much does it cost? And we're like, oh, it's your TCO is better with, uh, [00:14:00] AMD. [00:14:00] Anush Elangovan: So again, they're like, wow, okay, good. So now how do we deploy at scale? And then we go deploy it at scale. And when they give a thumbs up on that and they say, this is good, right? That's when you know, you, you see it go full circle from like, oh, we, we've never heard about AMD to like actually deploy to tens of thousands of GPUs In the order of a few months, right? It, it, it really is fascinating to see and very exciting and invigorating to [00:14:28] Andrew Zigler: Yeah. At like a great exposure to a lot of interesting problems. And, and then people using the infrastructure, the, the technology available to solve those problems. Really specific problems by the way, that's often why they're bringing their data and AI to it, uh, is because it is really specific and important for them. [00:14:45] Andrew Zigler: And there's a, a lot I think that other engineering orgs can learn and even emulate from AMD's success and, and having this open source ecosystem and it causing this acceleration within. You [00:15:00] know, uh, customers and enterprises that use and adopt the tools and, and, and that creates an advantage. And that goes back to why we're talking and like the real thesis of our conversation today. [00:15:10] Andrew Zigler: So how do you think engineering leaders that are listening to this and obviously tapping into this great success AMD has from an open source flywheel, how do you think other, other folks building in the same space can foster that open, first, that open source oriented culture in order to, you know, accelerate their innovation goals? [00:15:29] Anush Elangovan: Yeah, that's a very good question. So the startup that um, was acquired by AMD we, we built, I mean, we started off doing iot stuff and you know, smart ring and all that, right? But in the, the end of like, uh, and not the end, the last six years of the company was building ML compilers. [00:15:47] Anush Elangovan: And ml, ML compilers are like super, uh, complicated, sophisticated, advanced algorithms, dah, dah, dah. but it was all open source, right? So our VCs were like, wait, what do you mean your core [00:16:00] IP is open source? And um, the speed is the moat applied even then, right? It was just like, yes, if you have an idea that. [00:16:08] Anush Elangovan: Because someone saw this idea that you are, they're gonna be able to catch up, then you probably have the wrong idea anyway. But if they are, you know, you execute and they're gonna catch up, that you should assume they're gonna catch up. Right? So you gotta move forward. So keeping it open source is super important. [00:16:25] Anush Elangovan: But also to your question on like, you know, the learnings from an AMD standpoint, right? If there are, hard problems, I'd say dig in and work through it, right? Like there's no way but through it, right? That should be the simple mentality. And more, uh, frequently than not. you'll see that you'll just make it through in a, in, in good form. [00:16:52] Anush Elangovan: But if you doubt it and you're like, oh, I don't know if I should commit, if I'm, I, you know, what should just commit to do the right thing [00:17:00] every step, right? Every step, and just keep taking one step in front of the other. And in no time you'll see that you'll be running. Right. And, and yes, the first few steps will be like, yeah, everyone's complaining about your software quality. [00:17:15] Anush Elangovan: Everyone's complaining about this and that, and it doesn't work. And, and a few steps in, you know, you get, you get the hang of all the complaints that are coming in. You get the feedback loop. You're like, okay, what, what are you prioritizing again? One step in front of the other, right? You just keep knocking that out and then you get to a point where you're, it just becomes second nature, right? To do the, to do the right thing. And, and then yes, if someone gives you two options, you'll be like, fine. This is, uh, you know, there's always the resource trade off. There's always a human capital trade off, but what's the right thing to do? of course, I, I'm pragmatic about what we choose, but, but if the right thing for your long-term success is dig in, go first, principles, make it [00:18:00] happen. [00:18:00] Anush Elangovan: Well. Then just go for that. There's, there is no shortcut to [00:18:04] Andrew Zigler: acknowledging, you know, how it aligns with your mission, your core company goals, and what you're looking to achieve. And, and I, I love how you rightfully called out that in the open source world and you know, you have your technology that you've built, what you think is your moat upon, right? [00:18:22] Andrew Zigler: It's your code and, and to open source that, or to just make it where anyone could peer in is, you know. Scary in one regard, but two, it just kind of feels like you're handing away your throne room in some kind of sense, a very direct feeling sense. But the ultimately, you were really right to call out, and this is something I think about all the time, that the real power there is still the speed This the speed. [00:18:42] Andrew Zigler: That was the moat at the beginning of our conversation. It's the speed in combination with your. Very specific domain understanding of what you're building and what you're creating, and your new role as the steward of that world and how people plug into it, which [00:19:00] has frankly, a lot more influence and power than lording over a closed. [00:19:04] Andrew Zigler: You know, repository or an ecosystem, and like you said, like throwing things over the wall. Sure. There, there might be people always on the other side of that wall, but you're not gonna have a great connection with them. You're not gonna be able to really clearly understand them. I, I like your metaphor of the side of the field of the mountain a lot more. [00:19:23] Andrew Zigler: But, but in the, in this world, you know, where. That speed is, is the power and, and open source is just one way that you can harness that speed to get really far ahead and to innovate. , There's other parts of this equation that you can be experimenting with too, and I'd love to pick your brain about them as a software leader and, and, and one of them is about looking forward and kind of understanding that future that we're all building towards and beyond today's models and hardware. [00:19:48] Andrew Zigler: You know, what do you see as the next major bottleneck or opportunity in the AI compute space? As, as you know, enterprises and folks start to get a little more mature about what's available to [00:20:00] them. [00:20:00] Anush Elangovan: Yeah, I think, the bottleneck and opportunity is, uh, what I'd call, call walking the last mile of ai. Right. Uh, and like I I, I gave you an example, uh, previously, but, but it's similar to that. It's like there are cases where Humans have so many, uh, things to do in your day. You know, like the, if we sit down and actually had a customer focus like, okay, these customers lives, I'm gonna save four hours of this customer's life. And if you actually sit down and look at all of that, it'll be. Easily automatable, easily you know, uh, applicable, uh, for ai, right? [00:20:39] Anush Elangovan: Like, but then making it happen is gonna take a little bit, right? It's like maybe it's, uh, paying your utility bill, right? Or something like that, right? Or, or, your healthcare explanation of benefits. Uh, like, I'm sure you get an explanation of benefits, and I'm like, I, I don't even know what that thing is. [00:20:55] Anush Elangovan: It's just like EOB and like. [00:20:57] Andrew Zigler: it's a big, a big old PDF. Yeah, [00:21:00] exactly. [00:21:01] Anush Elangovan: Like, like, I'm like great straight to the, uh, shredder, right? And but that could be, you know, automated with the ai, right? It, it, it'd be like, Hey, the summary of this thing is you went and visited this day. Everything is okay. Everything is paid for, so don't worry, it's not a bill. [00:21:17] Anush Elangovan: That again, the same, uh, thing, but the sense of what that information overload is could be. Digested by ai, uh, accumulated over time and retrieved when you need it. Like, I don't, I actually don't even need to know this EOB right now, unless of course, whenever I need to know it, that maybe, you know, like for some benefits I need to figure out what do, what did I do over the past year and how do I apply it? Source:](https://image.24vids.com/tw-1994972575768727743/amplify_video_thumb/1994972220930621440/img/_5CCZJyz89oDfqQJ.jpg)
![Whitney Webb on 15-minute cities: "The goal [is] to have people... corralled [so] they're easily surveilled and controlled." "[They would] share... apartments when [they're] not there." "[They would] lose... car ownership, [so they] can't really control where [they] go." This clip of Webb (Whitney Webb), author of One Nation Under Blackmail and contributing editor of unlimitedhangout(.)com, is taken from an interview with Jimmy Dore (Jimmy Dore) posted to Rumble on March 26, 2026. ----------------Partial transcription of clip--------------- "So I haven't written extensively about 15- minute cities, but I would argue that the goal, there is basically to have people more or less corralled into an area where they're easily surveilled and controlled. And that's basically the... interest here is how do a small few rule the many forever without the many ever being able to complain or do anything about it. "Ultimately, this ruling system that they've been attempting to impose on, on people really around the world, because this is a global governance project at the end of the day, is, you know, using Big Tech tools in, in mass surveillance to basically create an entirely new way of life and system of living. "Part of that is to basically reduce the share of what the many, i.e., the 99% or whatever, have. So, you know, a lot of this, you know, became extremely, you know, unpopular. But also like people learned about it during the COVID era because of, you know, these groups like the World Economic Forum, which by the way, bills itself, is the premier promoter of public-private partnerships, that, you know, we need to not own our cars, we need to, rent them. And there should be autonomous fleets of Ubers that drive everyone around a specific radius. We shouldn't own homes. We should, you know, rent apartments and then share those apartments when we're not there and we leave, someone else can occupy the space. "These were all things, that were promoted under the guise, you know, of, of sustainability and other things at the time. But they're actively being, you know, designed and acted upon. "Actually one of the Columbus smart city initiatives that's connected to this Columbus partnership that that Wexner ran. He chaired it basically from 2001, I think, until 2021. So like 20 years, including when this was created. Columbus got a huge Department of Transportation grant from the government and also, you know, funding from private individuals, probably Wexner, but who knows, to to basically create a new system that in Columbus where private car ownership would not exist. "It would be fleets of, you know, smart cars, autonomous cars that drive people around. And so if you lose private car ownership, you can't really control where you go. And so these cars would determine, you know, would. Would have specific routes that you could, you know, pay to use and what have you. "And, interestingly enough, this was actually a goal for the entire United States, described in this by this national Security Commission on AI which was chaired by Eric Schmidt of Google and had a lot of these same Big Tech guys, who's who are have major roles at companies with New Albany data centers. "They basically said that in order for the US they said to beat China in AI it was necessary to end private car ownership in the United States and instead have autonomous, you know, Waymos, basically, drive every, fleets of them, Uber everybody around to where they were supposed to go and have things you know, sort of planned out by AI. Like where people are going, where people are working and all of this. "So the Technocracy Inc. model that you highlighted earlier, you know it was really influenced by things like Taylorism and a lot of these schools of thought that came out of the Industrial revolution that prioritize efficiency above all else. You know, having the trains run on time and all of that stuff being you know the kind of obsession of of these people in that particular era. "And so they want to sort of apply that not just to industry but to micromanaging people's lives as they you know, extract and exploit us for data and how much money our serf-like lives will make for them."](https://image.24vids.com/tw-2038319939497709608/amplify_video_thumb/2038316420845711360/img/_jjyJy6vXOx4xQkj.jpg)
![👽🔥 New Dylan - Biologics🔥👽 "There's things that I knew that these people were aware of, but even they would not say. One of those being biologics." ~DB "The agreement was that, if they died, that I run with it and just blow the whole thing up." ~DB Firsthand witnesses to the Legacy program, "would never come forward in a million years unless they were gonna die." ~DB "When I was still in government...I brought the people who worked on [the biological analysis of non-human bodies] to The Hill." ~Grusch ~ Jeremy Kenyon Lockyer Corbell: "Did you physically see photos? Did you physically see these documents?" Dylan Borland: "No, but because of how much was given to me in relay that the individuals that had relayed it, they were doing so because they were genuinely concerned for their life, because their careers were taken, their houses were broken into. I mean, computers taken, mailboxes gone through. And again, they knew what I was going through at this time. They had given me enough information, and the agreement was that, if they died, that I run with it and just blow the whole thing up." Corbell: "So he's got his firsthand experience of this tech, but then this is something George and I hear a lot. Which is, in the Legacy, when you're kind of put into the bad camp - you know, you're under scrutiny now - that there are these people that are threatening you, and you do feel afraid for your life. And we'll get to it, but there are some things that occurred to you as this gets kind of deeper and deeper with what's happening. "But just to be clear: So you're in a place where there's some sort of purgatory going on. Everybody has clearance, but they're in this sort of purgatory. You're in this sort of purgatory?" Borland: "A few of us, yep." Corbell: "And then, people directly involved in the Legacy program are afraid for their lives, so they're telling you so that at least somebody at their level can take that information if something bad happens to them?" Borland: "I think it was definitely that, but it was also, this is such an isolating, lonely experience, especially for young people to be exposed to the reality of this. If you already don't have the acknowledgement that it's a possibility, like if you're...I don't want to say closed minded. If you're an average Joe Blow going through life, and then all of a sudden this pops up on your radar, and you're seeing physical proof of it, you probably take a step back and go, 'whoa.' So you have that aspect, then these same people have that aspect of it, and they also have the aspect of their government destroying them." (In other words, people like us would be excited to see proof of what we all suspect. But someone new to the topic might freak out a bit.) George Knapp: "So they are going through the same thing you are." Borland "Exactly." Knapp: "Their clearances are in limbo, home break ins, threats..." Borland: "When I come into contact with these people, they had had to resign from their government position and take a contracting job for less money. They were, basically, blacklisted for six months. The only reason they ended up getting a job was because somebody on the Legacy program had hooked them up after six months. And they ended up where I was at, and they heard me talking all this stuff, and they're like, 'Oh, you ended up here too, buddy. So, uh, what the hell is going on here?' Knapp: "It's like the island of bad toys or something like that." Borland: "Yeah." Knapp: "You know, put them all in one basket." Borland: "After I saw what I saw, and I've experienced what I've experienced, I kind of...I think most of us have, taken the delve into all of this material (points toward a bookshelf full of what appear to be UFO books). And you're like, 'I know this is true, I know this is true, I know this is true. Who else is saying these true things? Who else is relaying information I know to be true, to try and make sense of your own life?' "Um, they were aware of what I was talking about. I don't know the capacity in which they were briefed in. There's things that I knew that these people were aware of, but even they would not say. Um, one of those being biologics." ~~~ (This is the best anecdote we have about government officials being briefed on bodies.) Joe Rogan: "When it comes to these...actual entities...do we have an understanding of how many of them we're talking about, and the variety of them?" Grusch: "There is a variety and we have a certain number of (laughs) different things... I talked to people who were familiar with the biological analysis of everything. So we have some idea, not a complete picture because it's like, you know, looking at it, it's like, well I don't even understand the physiology at all. It's like, what the heck? It's like, way different, right? So..." Rogan: "Is there a description of this physiology?" Grusch: "Yeah, no, I was in the room when uhhh... I gotta be careful, I don't wanna... I was in Washington, DC with a very number of senior people that work for members of Congress (Senate staffers seems like a safe bet ~Joe). Put it that way. When I was still in government. And I brought the people who worked on that stuff to The Hill. And this is why the members were so confident to put out the Schumer amendment and stuff. And, I was like, 'Please explain.' And they went into all those details and stuff. And I remember (laughs) some of the professional staff members were like, 'Whoa.' Like they were like, in G-Loc, right? Cause, I mean, and like, a total world bubble got burst right there for a lot of people." Source, with video... ~Back to Dylan~ Knapp: "You think there's a storehouse of that information that anybody would have put something away in case something bad happened to them? And do you know what happened to these people?" Borland: "You know the ones that I know still continue in the government. Um, I think they continue in classified-operations programs." Knapp: "They're not coming forward." Borland: "They would never come forward in a million years unless they were gonna die. And that's...it really sucks for me coming forward, because I only came forward because I sincerely believed they were going to die. Sucks."](https://image.24vids.com/tw-1973836754924024096/amplify_video_thumb/1973828016146120704/img/14hv48VX7OCn30ff.jpg)
![Combat correspondent Michael Yon: "[The Covid jabs are] clearly... a deployment... of a weapon of mass destruction... [But] Trump is still pushing it. [And people with] TDS are [those] that still support Trump in 2026... That is the power of mind control, and there is zero they will not do, and I mean zero." This clip of Yon (Michael Yon: Callsign BIG HONEY), who is also a photographer and author, is taken from a conversation with Liz Gunn (Liz Gunn) and Masako Ganaha (我那覇真子 Masako Ganaha) posted to the FreeNZ (FreeNZ) Rumble channel on January 11, 2026. ----------------Partial transcription of clip--------------- "It's clearly a weapon. They're showing one of several things, or potentially an overlap. But one would be either they just haven't researched it enough, or they're actually part of it, actually, because that was why they're using the wrong word. Or potentially they're a coward, because they're afraid to use the right word. That's actually cowardice. "And keep in mind, words are the atomic structures of truth and lies. So if you pick the wrong word from the beginning, all the rest of what you're talking about is irrelevant because you're talking about— You started with the wrong word. It's like, you know, started to try to make water out of, instead of using H2O, instead of using hydrogen and oxygen, used, lithium and sulfur or something, you know, it's just not going to work well. Well, you know, it's like, yeah, but. No, but this is water. You know, it's like, actually, it's just not, you know, and if you're talking about this as a vaccine or migration, when it's clearly an invasion, clearly weaponized migration at minimum. "But it's been being used. Used as a weapon in war, since it's being used as a weapon in war, remember, I mean, this flashlight is a weapon if you hit somebody with it. So what is a weapon? A weapon is something that you use as a weapon. And there are some things that are designed to be meant to be used as a weapon. This is meant to be used as a light. "But what is a weapon? I mean, if you end up in a courtroom because of a use of a weapon, then they're going to say, yeah, that, that, that spoon was a weapon, you know, but, but, but some are actually designed as WMD. And clearly this was a deployment and employment of a weapon of mass destruction. And Trump is still pushing it. He's still pushing it. "In his cult, keep in mind the highest, they've got severe. There's a lot of severe TDS going on. They call it Trump Derangement syndrome. That's— The TDS are the people that still support Trump in 2026. Despite that, he still put— Mary Bowden, she just said on an interview a couple days ago that. I thought she said 5.5 million children took it again last year, but it might have been 5.8. But anyway, over 5 million. "That much is clear, that Dr. Bowden said more than 5 million children have taken the jab just in the last year. Right. So if her numbers are accurate, even if it's 10 children. I mean, he's still not backing off of it. He's clearly using the weapon to destroy the United States. And so never underestimate the power of information, war and psychological operations specifically. There's people who literally, they have dead family members and they're sick and they still support the guy who's doing it. That is the power of mind control. It is absolutely severe. People with that level of mind control, there is absolutely zero they will not do, and I mean zero."](https://image.24vids.com/tw-2010831437964996725/amplify_video_thumb/2010828902256820224/img/MxFPUoiVHPXkqaV-.jpg)
![Whoopi Goldberg dismisses Pratt losing his house in the wildfires and says he needs to know what he's talking about and offer "solutions" before "passing judgment" on Karen Bass. She claims he doesn't "understand what people are going through": GOLDBERG: No, he's not the answer but here's the thing, nobody -- You know, they have bitched about these wildfires as long as I've lived in California, it's always been -- it's always been a problem. But what I don't like is if you don't have any solutions that have not been already tried or if you're throwing shade on people saying she diverted water from this place -I mean, you have to -- you have to have some idea of what needs to be done. A lot of people were affected by those wildfires, a lot of my friends, a lot of people you know lost everything. HOSTIN: Right. GOLDBERG: So this is not, you know, a ha, ha, let's do an A.I. video. This is real stuff. People -- this is people's lives. And so, before you're passing judgment, you need to be able to tell people what you have to offer, Spencer. [Applause] You know, and, you know, I don't know what qualifies as the right way to be a politician, but what I do know is they have to be the people who understand what people are going through. And if you don't understand what people are going through, in the way they're going through it, when you're talking about communities, whole communities that have been burned out, whole groups, legacies that are gone. It's more than just this. It's all these things. You got to be prepared for a lot more stuff than I think you -- it is a really hard job and in California particularly.](https://image.24vids.com/tw-2054961107781988733/amplify_video_thumb/2054961051175735296/img/3F9XZJjRPFALzMbW.jpg)
![🔥🛸👽 Grusch: Senior Congressional Staffers Had Their World-Bubble Burst After Being Briefed on the Biological Analysis and Physiology of Alien Bodies 👽🛸🔥 (This is one of the most important claims in the history of the topic because, if true, it overcomes the, "It-may-be-our-tech" argument.) Rogan: "So, when it comes to these...I'm gonna bring it back to these, these actual entities." Grusch: "Yeah." Rogan: "Do we know, or [do we] have an understanding of how many of them we're talking about, and the variety of them?" Grusch: "Yeah, there is a variety, and we have a certain number of (laughs) different things, umm. But the like, total numbers of like, what's interacting with us on Earth? I mean, nobody knows that. And, I mean, that..." Rogan: "But there's an understanding of some that they do believe are interacting with us, and there's a variety in terms of...there's variables?" Grusch: "Yeah, I talked to people who are familiar with the biological analysis and everything. So we have some idea, not a complete picture, because it's like, you know, you know, you're looking at, it's like, well, I don't even understand the physiology at all. It's like, what the heck? It's like, way different, right? So, umm...we have at least a..." Rogan: "Is there a description of this physiology? Grusch: "Yeah, no, I was in...I was in the room when, uhhh (exhales)...hmm. I gotta be careful, I don't wanna... I was in Washington, DC with a very number of senior people that work for members of Congress - put it that way - umm, when I was still in government. And I brought the people who worked on that stuff to The Hill. I mean, this is why the members were so confident to put out the Schumer amendment (UAPDA) and stuff. And I was like, 'Please explain.' "And, um, they went into all those details and stuff. And I remember, you know (laughs), some of the professional staff members were like, 'Whoa.' Like, they were like, in G-LOC, right? Because, I mean it's like a total world-bubble, umm...got burst right there for a lot of people. "And, so we have some idea, it's not a complete picture. I mean, it's just like...but you're not even bringing in the right people. Like, I think about my friend and colleague, Dr. Garry P. Nolan, which I started the SOL Foundation non-profit with. I mean, he's like, Nobel-level, biologist, virologist. Like, he's the guy that you would want on it, but he's not on it. So, I think we can make a lot of progress in our understanding once again, if this is more broadly studied in an open environment." ~ Note: G-LOC = Gravity-Induced Loss of Consciousness. In Laymen's terms, losing consciousness when a plane pulls more Gs than your body can handle. Source: dot com/blog/what-is-g-loc](https://image.24vids.com/tw-2050662480012296693/amplify_video_thumb/2050636008421838848/img/2L3ynKMT89gG9z0l.jpg)