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NEVER BEFORE SEEN KOBE FOOTAGE! Summer 1997, Magic Johnson’s midsummer nights Kobe Bryant, TMac (before he ever played an NBA game), Brent Barry, Michael Finley, Jerry Stackhouse, Penny Hardaway, Stephon Marbury & Ray Allen. (Not shown Charles O’Bannon (cont)
1,455,955 Aufrufe • vor 3 Jahren •via X (Twitter)
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Also, let’s address this asap. Vince Carter did not steal this dunk from Kobe. The elbow dunk goes back on film back to as far back as 1986 with Roy Hinson. Barry Hardy, James Wilson deserve some love there too. VC innovated the reverse 360 windmill & many other things. (Cont)
@teamflightbros @Tmac_213 @jerrystackhouse @Barryathree @StarburyMarbury NGL…TMac won that easily
@teamflightbros @Tmac_213 @jerrystackhouse @Barryathree @StarburyMarbury They slapping that Kirk Franklin 😂
@teamflightbros @Tmac_213 @jerrystackhouse @Barryathree @StarburyMarbury This is so dope. It’s so rare I come across a Kobe video I’ve never seen before.
@teamflightbros @Tmac_213 @jerrystackhouse @Barryathree @StarburyMarbury Young Ray Allen was something different! RIP KOBE MANE
Kobe did that elbow dunk with ease… ole buddy from the dunk contest this year or last year had to use the net to pull himself up to do the same dunk
@teamflightbros @Tmac_213 @jerrystackhouse @Barryathree @StarburyMarbury Kobe & T Mac was going at it 🔥
@teamflightbros @Tmac_213 @jerrystackhouse @Barryathree @StarburyMarbury T Mac was a different species back then
@teamflightbros @Tmac_213 @jerrystackhouse @Barryathree @StarburyMarbury So Kobe invented the arm in the rim dunk??? Not Vince???
@teamflightbros @Tmac_213 @jerrystackhouse @Barryathree @StarburyMarbury No
![Scott Brooks: "You can argue the [Lakers] had the best player ever to play the game [Kobe] for 20 years..." Pat Riley: "He ranks right there with Jordan." David Stern: "Kobe is there with Michael." Dr J.: "[Kobe's] as good as anyone who's ever played. Let's put it that way." George Gervin: "He set himself apart from everyone else." Kevin Durant: "How do you not say [Kobe and Jordan] are by far better than anybody who's played the game?" Isaiah Thomas: “I mean, he’s the greatest of all time in life and in basketball." Adeyemi Adediran (B/R 2010): "KOBE BRYANT IS THE GREATEST PLAYER TO EVER TOUCH A BASKETBALL." Jerry Rice: "Greatest of all time. You have to earn that title, and I think Kobe did that." Randy Moss: "Kobe Bryant is the best basketball player that I've ever seen dribble a basketball." Mark Jackson: "I never thought I would say it playing against Michael Jordan for so long but Kobe Bryant at the end of the day...will go down as the greatest basketball player that has ever lived." Mark Schlererh: "One time, one game, I'm taking Kobe Bryant." Paul Pierce: "If a game is on the line and I need one game, I want Kob." Steve Smith: "He's the best, most fundamentaly [sound] player I've ever played against or watched." Kendrick Perkins: "Most skilled to EVER play the game, it's not even a debate." Chauncey Billups: "I think Kobe is more skilled than any player that's ever played." Phil Jackson when asked if Kobe has better basketball skills than Michael Jordan: "He does." Vince Carter: "I mean, I still have to give it (GOAT) to Michael Jordan, with a close Kobe Bryant 2nd." Paul Westphal: "Who is to say Kobe Bryant isn’t going to be better than Michael Jordan? Let’s get that out on the table right now. He’s a lot better than Jordan was at the same age." Shaq: "If you want to have that conversation (GOAT), there has to be another name added to that - Kobe." Rip Hamilton: "Whoever voted Kobe [at 10] flat out disrespected him...when Magic comes out and says Kobe is the best Laker of all-time, that means better than him and better than the guy Magic played with, Kareem Abdul-Jabbar." Rudy Tomjanovich: "I truly believe [Kobe] has the chance to become the greatest player to ever play the game." Greg Anthony: "Kobe Bryant is the most complete basketball player the game has ever seen." Shaq: "You know what, I had the greatest player ever. We could've won six or seven championships, but you live and you learn." Allen Iverson: "I don't understand how they don't have the debate when it comes to Kobe." Mike Breen: "It's starting to happen again Mark, the conversation, the debate on is [Kobe] as good as Michael Jordan. It's been blasphemy to say it, really about anybody, but it's an actual discussion you can have now. Mark Jackson: "Well I said it a year and a half ago, no way in the world would I ever put anybody in the conversation with Michael Jordan but Kobe Bryant is there. He's as good as Michael Jordan on any given day. I said to Bryant yesterday,, 'it's almost like Larry Holmes and Muhammad Ali.' He looked at me and said, 'I'm not Larry Holmes.' And he is 100% right. It is two Muhammad Ali's when you talk about Jordan and Bryant." Grant Taylor (B/R 2011): "Players that come to mind are Bill Russell, Wilt Chamberlain, Jerry West, Kareem Abdul-Jabbar, Magic Johnson, Larry Bird, Michael Jordan. But I've now officially put Kobe Bryant on this list, and judging by the title of this article, it is clear I'm not just saying he belongs with these players. No. Kobe Bryant is the greatest and most legendary of all these players." Charles Barkley: "Kobe Bryant is the best player I’ve ever seen other than Michael Jordan." Matt Barnes: "To me, Jordan is 1 and Kobe is 1B." Phil Jackson on who he'd pick to start a team with between Kobe and Jordan: “I’d do a coin flip and whichever one came up heads or tails, I would take that person.”](https://image.24vids.com/tw-2004031599382233457/amplify_video_thumb/2004031536769781760/img/aRF_H8AMIGcoLke2.jpg)
![Greatest PLAYER Ever in the history of NBA!🔥🔥 Dwyane Wade: Jordan is the best for this game, but Kobe is the master. Chris Bosh: I knew Kobe, but I didn't know him. Played basketball against him. He's the best player ever, and he was almost untouchable. Kyrie Irving: When I say [Kobe is] the greatest to play this game, it doesn’t mean I’m knocking anybody else, all right? The greatest to play this game to me! I don’t give a f*** what you talking about. I don’t care about your stats.” Anthony Davis: Kobe and MJ are the two greatest players of all-time. Kevin Durant: Kobe Bryant is the greatest of all time. His skill is second to none. Him and Michael Jordan are neck and neck as far as skill. Dirk Nowitzki: His skill level was unbelievable. There was not one shot he didn’t have in his repertoire. So, to me, in my 20 years, he was probably the best offensive or the best player I’ve seen/faced. Tony Allen: He pushed me past my limits, and I did the same to him. To me, that's what makes him the greatest. Steve Smith NBA: [Kobe] was the most fundamentally sound player that I've seen play. #GregAnthony: Kobe Bryant is the most complete basketball player the game has ever seen. Tony Parker: Maybe the closest to Michael Jordan, who I think is the best ever. #MattBarnes: Jordan is 1, and Kobe is 1B. Jamal Crawford: There's no list I will ever respect if Kobe Bryant isn't top 5. Klay Thompson: He's the greatest in my eyes. He is the reason I play today. Nate Robinson: Kobe, in my opinion, is second to MJ as the most complete player ever. Metta World Peace: There are legends, then there are guys who are in a class of their own. Kobe is in a class of his own. #WaltFrazier: Players see him as the biggest icon in basketball, and he deserves it. Mike knows that. Isaiah Thomas: I'm still a Kobe guy when it comes to the GOAT conversation. #KenyonMartin: [In] my 15 years of playing basketball, Kobe Bryant was the best basketball player in the National Basketball Association." Dwight Howard: "Everything Michael Jordan did, Kobe did better." Kevin Durant: "Kobe is the Greatest of all time. His skill is second to none. Him and Michael Jordan are 1A, 1B as far as skill." Shannon Brown: "Kobe is the best of all time. He comes first before Jordan." Brandon Jennings: "Jordan never win a championship without Pippen. Kobe won 2 without all time great teammates. Kobe is the GOAT."](https://image.24vids.com/tw-1965401623007514979/amplify_video_thumb/1965401249534136320/img/gaZ_9gXQX_eMikIo.jpg)
![Greatest PLAYER Ever in the history of NBA!🔥🔥 Dwyane Wade: Jordan is the best for this game, but Kobe is the master. Chris Bosh: I knew Kobe, but I didn't know him. Played basketball against him. He's the best player ever, and he was almost untouchable. Kyrie Irving: When I say [Kobe is] the greatest to play this game, it doesn’t mean I’m knocking anybody else, all right? The greatest to play this game to me! I don’t give a f*** what you talking about. I don’t care about your stats.” Anthony Davis: Kobe and MJ are the two greatest players of all-time. Kevin Durant: Kobe Bryant is the greatest of all time. His skill is second to none. Him and Michael Jordan are neck and neck as far as skill. Dirk Nowitzki: His skill level was unbelievable. There was not one shot he didn’t have in his repertoire. So, to me, in my 20 years, he was probably the best offensive or the best player I’ve seen/faced. Tony Allen: He pushed me past my limits, and I did the same to him. To me, that's what makes him the greatest. Steve Smith NBA: [Kobe] was the most fundamentally sound player that I've seen play. #GregAnthony: Kobe Bryant is the most complete basketball player the game has ever seen. Tony Parker: Maybe the closest to Michael Jordan, who I think is the best ever. #MattBarnes: Jordan is 1, and Kobe is 1B. Jamal Crawford: There's no list I will ever respect if Kobe Bryant isn't top 5. Klay Thompson: He's the greatest in my eyes. He is the reason I play today. Nate Robinson: Kobe, in my opinion, is second to MJ as the most complete player ever. Metta World Peace: There are legends, then there are guys who are in a class of their own. Kobe is in a class of his own. #WaltFrazier: Players see him as the biggest icon in basketball, and he deserves it. Mike knows that. Isaiah Thomas: I'm still a Kobe guy when it comes to the GOAT conversation. #KenyonMartin: [In] my 15 years of playing basketball, Kobe Bryant was the best basketball player in the National Basketball Association." Dwight Howard: "Everything Michael Jordan did, Kobe did better." Kevin Durant: "Kobe is the Greatest of all time. His skill is second to none. Him and Michael Jordan are 1A, 1B as far as skill." Shannon Brown: "Kobe is the best of all time. He comes first before Jordan." Brandon Jennings: "Jordan never win a championship without Pippen. Kobe won 2 without all time great teammates. Kobe is the GOAT."](https://image.24vids.com/tw-1872443723998527723/amplify_video_thumb/1872443607321300992/img/J1gG2oRWxJ9R_k5J.jpg)
![KD on seeing Kobe score 81 points: "This is the greatest player I ever seen."🐐 "[Kobe] strived so hard to be Michael Jordan. When I go back and I look at his videos and I say to myself, ‘Damn he was better than Michael Jordan.’” - Scottie Pippen Phil Jackson : Kobe Is More Skilled Than Jordan. Greatest PLAYER Ever in the history of NBA!🔥🔥 Dwyane Wade: Jordan is the best for this game, but Kobe is the master. Chris Bosh: I knew Kobe, but I didn't know him. Played basketball against him. He's the best player ever, and he was almost untouchable. Kyrie Irving: When I say [Kobe is] the greatest to play this game, it doesn’t mean I’m knocking anybody else, all right? The greatest to play this game to me! I don’t give a f*** what you talking about. I don’t care about your stats.” Anthony Davis: Kobe and MJ are the two greatest players of all-time. Kevin Durant: Kobe Bryant is the greatest of all time. His skill is second to none. Him and Michael Jordan are neck and neck as far as skill. Dirk Nowitzki: His skill level was unbelievable. There was not one shot he didn’t have in his repertoire. So, to me, in my 20 years, he was probably the best offensive or the best player I’ve seen/faced. Tony Allen: He pushed me past my limits, and I did the same to him. To me, that's what makes him the greatest. Steve Smith NBA: [Kobe] was the most fundamentally sound player that I've seen play. #GregAnthony: Kobe Bryant is the most complete basketball player the game has ever seen. Tony Parker: Maybe the closest to Michael Jordan, who I think is the best ever. #MattBarnes: Jordan is 1, and Kobe is 1B. Jamal Crawford: There's no list I will ever respect if Kobe Bryant isn't top 5. Klay Thompson: He's the greatest in my eyes. He is the reason I play today. Nate Robinson: Kobe, in my opinion, is second to MJ as the most complete player ever. Metta World Peace: There are legends, then there are guys who are in a class of their own. Kobe is in a class of his own. #WaltFrazier: Players see him as the biggest icon in basketball, and he deserves it. Mike knows that. Isaiah Thomas: I'm still a Kobe guy when it comes to the GOAT conversation. #KenyonMartin: [In] my 15 years of playing basketball, Kobe Bryant was the best basketball player in the National Basketball Association." Dwight Howard: "Everything Michael Jordan did, Kobe did better." Kevin Durant: "Kobe is the Greatest of all time. His skill is second to none. Him and Michael Jordan are 1A, 1B as far as skill." Shannon Brown: "Kobe is the best of all time. He comes first before Jordan." Brandon Jennings: "Jordan never win a championship without Pippen. Kobe won 2 without all time great teammates. Kobe is the GOAT."If you want stats, look for LeBron. If you want rings, look for Russell. If you want MVPs, look for Kareem. If you want records, look for Wilt. If you want impact, look for Steph. If you want dominance in a position, look for Shaq. If you want perimeter defense, find Gary Payton. If you want athletics, find Kemp, Giannis or Malone. If you want greatness, look for Bird or Magic. If you want exquisite dunks, look for Carter, Dr. J or Wilkins. If you want a good Trash Talker, look for Garnett. If you want influence, look for Iverson. If you want remarkable scoring skills, look for Durant. If you want competitiveness, look for Michael. If you want Impavidez at Clutch moment, look for Michael again. Now, if you want a good slice of all that fit to a single player, then look for Kobe Bryant 🐐 #MambaForever #mambamentality 🐐](https://image.24vids.com/tw-1900185586847084863/amplify_video_thumb/1900185219639984128/img/TpvN8RYibkGOzudQ.jpg)
!["Jordan is the best for this game, but Kobe is the master." Dwyane Wade "To me, Kobe is the best player in history. He comes before Jordan." Shannon Brown "I knew Kobe, but I didn't know him. Played basketball against him. He's the best player ever, and he was almost untouchable." Chris Bosh "How do you not say [Kobe and Jordan] are by far better than anybody who's played the game?" Kevin Durant “I mean, he’s the greatest of all time in life and in basketball." Isaiah Thomas "He's the best, most fundamentaly [sound] player I've ever played against or watched." Steve Smith "[Bryant] could arguably be 1. In some polls, he’ll be 2,” the Nets coach said yesterday about the players he has seen since he entered the NBA in 1988. “He could be 1-A and Jordan can be 1-B or Jordan, some polls they’ll be flipped." Avery Johnson "I would say [MJ] 1 and [Kobe] 1A, just giving MJ a little edge." - Horace Grant "Man, how did Kobe learn everything this dude [MJ] did to a T? And then he made it a little better in some areas.” - Robert Horry “I think he is better than Jordan and I only say that because I felt like everything Jordan did, he did it better.” - Dwight Howard "Kobe Bryant is the most complete basketball player the game has ever seen." - Greg Anthony “I never thought I would say it playing against Michael Jordan for so long but Kobe Bryant at the end of the day...will go down as the greatest basketball player that has ever lived." - Mark Jackson "When I say [Kobe is] the greatest to play this game, it doesn’t mean I’m knocking anybody else, all right? The greatest to play this game to me! I don’t give a f*** what you talking about. I don’t care about your stats.” Kyrie Irving "He pushed me past my limits, and I did the same to him. To me, that's what makes him the greatest." Tony Allen "He's the greatest in my eyes. He is the reason I play today." Klay Thompson](https://image.24vids.com/tw-1913233894880469046/ext_tw_video_thumb/1913233825125044224/pu/img/V02nO4Dp_-C6ya_l.jpg)
!["I may be wrong about Elizondo...but I think that the rush to condemn him strikes me as premature [and], potentially, damaging to the community and to the disclosure effort." ~Dolan (This is WAY too long, and I probably should have spent my time on something else. But here it is. The video clips give you a taste of Richard Dolan's excellent 31-minute video.) "The theory that's been put out (by Gerb) contains, at least in my view, substantial problems of evidence, of chronology, and, at times, I just have to say, basic logic." ~Dolan "I am suggesting that Elizondo probably helped to create the opening that allowed Grusch to go even further." ~Dolan ~~~ Gerb in March: "When did Lue Elizondo start talking about crash retrievals? That was after David Grusch went public. You will not find him speaking about it beforehand." (As I've shown before, that's just not true. Did Gerb not do his research on that? I'll share A LOT of quotes from this Richard Dolan (Richard Dolan Intelligent Disclosure) podcast, and from my previous posts detailing the various times Lue has addressed crash retrievals. Plus, my take on various points. Dolan starts out by praising Gerb's research. I agree. Then he moves on to the Lue-was-brought-in-by Clapper claim.) Dolan: "The theory that's been put out (by Gerb) contains, at least in my view, substantial problems of evidence, of chronology, and, at times, I just have to say, basic logic." Dolan: Gerb claims Elizondo had to adapt his public position on crash retrievals because Grusch coming forward changed the game. "Gerb called this, adapt or die. "I think I understand what [Gerb] means by the controlled narrative and what it was intended to reveal and what it was supposed to hide (crash retrievals). What I still do NOT understand is why anyone protecting a retrieval program would initiate this type of a strategy." Dolan: Before 2017, one of the most significant protections for any alleged Legacy program was ridicule, silence and ignoring. "As long as UFOs remained culturally disreputable, any claims of crash retrievals were easily just brushed aside without any bother to investigate. That didn't change until December of 2017," and the two NYT articles. "That kickstarted a major, mainstream, national-security discussion. "So, if this was a controlled-disclosure program, my question simply is: You get the government, eventually admitting, that non-human intelligence seem to be operating advanced craft here, who could not know that the next questions would be inevitable? Like, have any of these crashed? Were any of these recovered? Where did the material go? Who's been studying it? In other words, this would, obviously, increase pressure on the retrieval secret. It would not protect it in any logical way. The most safest option would have to be continued silence. "Maybe this strategy could become plausible if insiders believed that something was about to emerge beyond their control, right? Some kind of trigger. Maybe there would be an imminent whistleblower that we do not know about 'til this day, that they were afraid of and they wanted to get out ahead of the narrative. Or some kind of foreign disclosure. Some other reason, some other cause that would prompt the secret keepers to think, 'Okay, we need to get out a controlled disclosure.' But, there really is no evidence that's presented, in any of Gerb's analysis, for such a triggering event. Why would the custodians of this secret, voluntarily, weaken the whole system that had protected them for decades and decades?" (Agree. I've had this convo with friends over the years about the theory that TTSA was created to get ahead of a disclosure effort that was coming from someone/somewhere else. But it never made sense because we could never find anything (disclosure-wise) that was happening before 2017 that would force the hand of the gatekeepers into starting some type of controlled disclosure such as what TTSA was allegedly doing. Except maybe... Dolan talks about how, when Hillary Clinton was running for President in 2015 and 2016, she mentioned UFOs and UAP in various interviews on the campaign trail. Dolan: That was gradually making UFOs, "slightly, and I would say, very slightly, becoming more acceptable to discuss." Plus, John Podesta (her campaign manager) was pushing for declassification of UFO files. "There were people at that time who really did believe that Hillary Clinton would become the Disclosure president." (I wanted to vote 3rd party in 2016 and didn't want to vote for Hillary, but did so, in part, in the hopes (slim hopes) that she would engage in some sort of disclosure, if she won.) Dolan: "I've always interpreted [Hillary talking UFOs during her campaign] as a much more, just pragmatic, you could almost say, cynical, if you want, treatment of the [UFO] subject, just to win some votes. The most that she ever said as a candidate, I think was, she would try to get to the bottom of this, whatever that means." (Well, she said more than that... ⬇️⬇️⬇️ “I think we may have been (visited already). We don’t know for sure.” ~Hillary Clinton That was covered in the NYT in 2015 My full post on that Hillary quote is here. ⬇️⬇️⬇️ And let's not forget the photo of Hillary from August 1995 where she's with Laurance Rockefeller on his ranch and holding Paul Davies' book, "Are We Alone? Philosophical Implications of the Discovery of Extraterrestrial Life." She and President Clinton have an interest in this subject.) ~~~ Dolan: "I just think that the leap from a political opportunity - talking about UFOs during the campaign - to a kind of, James Clapper-managed disclosure operation? I just don't think that's been demonstrated and I don't find it very persuasive." ~~~ Dolan then gets back to this claim by Gerb... Gerb in March: "When did Lue Elizondo start talking about crash retrievals? That was after David Grusch went public (in 2023). You will not find him speaking about it beforehand." Dolan: Gerb said that, "Elizondo, essentially, avoided discussing crash retrievals, except for Roswell, And that is just not accurate." (The Lue-avoided-crash-retrievals-until-Grusch quote from Gerb in March didn't include an exception about Roswell so maybe Gerb saw my posts on that and updated his claim? But it's still wrong. Dolan brought up Lue's comments on Tucker Carlson in May of 2019, but no other comments from Lue. I covered that and much more in various posts, which I'll share here.) Did Lue Avoid Talking About Crash Retrievals Before Grusch Went Public in 2023? From the 12/16/17 NYT article that started it all. "Under Mr. Bigelow’s direction, [BAASS] modified buildings in Las Vegas for the storage of metal alloys and other materials that Mr. Elizondo and program contractors said had been recovered from unidentified aerial phenomena." (Not a direct quote, and not exactly "crash retrievals of vehicles" but the seed had been planted in that first article. We know now (allegedly) that at least one of those buildings was supposed to store exotic materials that Lockheed was going to divest itself from, but the CIA nixed it all. Again, allegedly.) ~May of 2019~ Tucker Carlson: "Do you believe, based on your decade of serving in the U.S. government, on this question, that the U.S. government has in its possession any material from one of these aircrafts?" Lue: "Whoa. Umm…I do, yes." Tucker Carlson: "You think the U.S. government has debris from a UFO in its possession right now?" Lue: "Unfortunately, Tucker, I really have to be careful of my NDA. I really can’t go into a lot of…more detail than that." Tucker Carlson: "Okay." (And that could have been the end of the interview. But Lue decided to add this.) Lue: "But…simply put, yes." ~ NYT article in July of 2020... "Mr. Elizondo is among a small group of former government officials and scientists with security clearances who, without presenting physical proof, say they are convinced that objects of undetermined origin have crashed on earth with materials retrieved for study." ~ "My personal belief in Roswell? 100%. But I cannot speak officially and I cannot discuss about anything else that may or may not have transcribed." ~Lue on "Disclosure Tonight in Feb. 2021 Source: ~ Lue on Clubhouse in July of 2021 Lue: "Am I aware of the notion that there was some sort of retrieval of biological samples? Yes, I am aware of that notion. Am I aware that there may have been some U.S. government involvement in that? Yes, I am aware of that as well. I am aware that people have talked about it and I have heard it as well...regarding, anecdotally, of biological recovery." Source and longer transcript... ~ Lue on Dossier X in April of 2021 Lue: "You said something...that (Roswell) was the 1st time the U.S. gov't was engaged, and I'll share with you, that may not necessarily be true. There may be anecdotal information that indicates that perhaps the U.S. government was involved even before that, in purported, recovery-type activities." Host: "You mean probably 1942, in Los Angeles or something?" Lue: "I don't wanna elaborate, yet. I think some information's gonna come to light here, probably pretty soon, about some interesting incidents. Again, it's not up to me...there are some people out there are willing to come forward, I think. I'm just providing you the information that was indicated to me. I think we need to be careful jumping to presumptions or assumptions that Roswell was the first event similar to what we're thinking about." Source: ~ "I think people would be surprised to know there's more to Roswell than I think most people are aware of. Some people are aware of it. But, you know, there's more to Roswell and there's other similar incidents that are equally compelling." ~Lue on UFO Garage in 2022 Source: ~~~ March of 2022 - My Interview with Lue Murgia: "You said you believe Roswell was real. Are you as confident in other incidents as you are with Roswell?" Lue: "Yeah." Murgia: "Yes?" Lue: "Yeah." Murgia: "Okay." Lue: "Yeah." Murgia: After you were on Tucker and said you believed the U.S. government had material and debris from a UFO, "Eric Davis came out and said, '100%!' And he said landed craft, too. Did you see that when that came out?" Lue: "I'm aware of that." Murgia: "(laughs) Okay." (Probably an inappropriate laugh by me as Lue was dead serious and probably pushing the limits of what he was allowed to say in public about crash retrievals. He later said this in his November 2024 congressional testimony.) Lue in 2024: "I signed documentation three years ago that restricts my ability to discuss, specifically, crash retrievals." (I wonder what would have happened if he had refused to sign that?) ~~~ Dolan: "Grusch definitely went further (than Lue), much further, yes. That's a lot different from claiming that Elizondo kept retrievals outside the public narrative until Grusch forced his hand. And you really have to ask, if Elizondo's job was NOT to reveal the crash retrieval program, why, in 2019 - again, four years before David Grusch, is he going on and putting it out there? It just seems like there's a chronology problem there." (1000%, Richard! Makes no sense. My June 29th post was entitled... If Elizondo Was Brought in to Control the UFO Narrative Away from Crash Retrievals, He Did a Poor Job 🛸 Nice to see Richard and I on the same page with that. Richard speculates how the disclosure effort would look like right now if Lue hadn't gone public. Would we have several UAP hearings in the books by now? Would David Grusch had come forward? No way to know.) Dolan: "But I will say, or suggest, that it's entirely reasonable to think that Elizondo helped to create the institutional and cultural conditions that made someone like David Grusch possible. Elizondo did not keep retrieval out of the discussion." (In July of 2023, I directed this tweet to Lue.) "None of this would be happening without you." ~Murgia (Over the top and a bit fan-boyish? Probably. But... Knapp talking with Senator Harry Reid about Lazar and UFOs in 1989 - in a limo headed to the airport that would later bear Reid’s name - was a vital part of getting this whole thing started. Lacatski and Stratton launching the more recent effort around 2005, which eventually led to AAWSAP, AATIP and the UAPTF, was also REALLY important. But Lue going public in 2017 was MASSIVE. The media coverage that followed brought a ton of new people into the topic, and I’m not sure where we’d be today without it. Dolan goes on to talk about Clapper and how it's conceivable he would be on top of any alleged Legacy UAP/crash retrieval program. But he failed to note what Grusch said this past January on "The Megyn Kelly Show." Grusch: "General Clapper was well aware of the crash retrieval issue, managed the crash retrieval issue, and...he placed people in critical roles to manage this issue." (Is Lue one of the people Grusch was referring to? Does he have proof of that? From my own information, I have no doubt that Clapper was instrumental in Lue being connected to the UFO topic. But exactly how that went down and what did it entail? I don't know. I hope Clapper speaks to all of this in detail one day soon.) ~ Dolan: "Gerb has stated that Clapper gave cover to AATIP and, basically, directed the National Security Council retrieval activities. And that he selected Elizondo as the front man. Gerb described Clapper as the mob boss of the NSC crash-retrieval portfolio. "Those are very, very powerful allegations. I'm not saying they're NOT true, but that interview with Ross Coulthart, I would say, did not produce anything in the way that anyone would actually call evidence. Like, there was no documents...or firsthand witnesses that were named, or anything like that. "So you have this, basically, a link from Clapper, to the NSC operation, to AATIP, to Elizondo, to controlled disclosure. This could be true, but no one's seen any receipts on this, and I would like to. "And there's more things that I think raise questions about this whole scenario, frankly. I mean, I think of the Pentagon campaign against Lue Elizondo, which lasted for many years. Any theory that has Elizondo as a controlled-disclosure frontman, I think has to account for the documented, institutional effort by the Pentagon to undermine Lue Elizondo." (When the Pentagon spokespeople said that Lue had no assigned responsibilities for AATIP, it's not so clear cut to say they were trying to undermine Lue, since AAWSAP also had the nickname of AATIP, which I'll call AATIP 1. So, if we're talking about AATIP 1 (AAWSAP), Lue did NOT have any assigned responsibilities, except early on when he did some counter-intelligence. And if we're talking AATIP 2, which Stratton said he created in 2015, Knapp explained in 2019 that it was, "not so much a program as it was a loose network of intelligence officials in different agencies." And on April 8th of this year, Lacatski told Knapp that, "they started using AATIP in 2015-16 to describe their uh...what would you describe that as, more lunchtime get togethers? And George Knapp is laughing. I don't know how else to describe it." That tells me Lacatski felt AATIP was REALLY informal, and that could explain why Lue's role wasn't clear cut in the minds of those spokespeople, and why so many of my contacts told me he wasn't the director of AATIP. But those same folks also told me Lue played in an important role in that effort. My guess is that, since AATIP was so informal, there really was NO official director, but that should be clarified when Stratton's book comes out. Semantics? Maybe.) Dolan: Gerb's hypothesis featuring, "the management of an approved public representative (Lue) of a controlled-disclosure narrative...just doesn't make sense to me. What does make sense to me is something like a factional conflict. I think [that's] much more of a logical explanation for everything that we have seen. You have one group that may have supported some kind of opening - not even necessarily a complete opening - while another fought to preserve the secrecy as much as possible. "But that's a bureaucratic struggle. That's not, necessarily, a unified, controlled-disclosure operation. So I think that is a contradiction that was not really adequately discussed in this hypothesis. "I may be wrong about Elizondo, and I'm not here, again, to be his defense attorney. But I think that the rush to condemn him strikes me as premature. It strikes me also as, potentially, damaging to the community and to the disclosure effort, frankly. We can investigate serious allegations without first assigning everyone the role of either hero or villain. "So, I guess I would say that Gerb may have genuinely identified some real relationships and hidden activity. In fact, knowing his excellent research track record, I would be surprised if he didn't. "Elizondo - probably - does have undisclosed elements in his background, and I have no doubt he knows much more than he has said. When I look at the this idea of, like. you look at TTSA coming out at the end of 2016, and you see, basically, a kind of faction that had a very managed narrative indeed. Like, they did not come out and talk about crash retrievals. They did not at all. They talked about these military encounters and sensor readings and this type of thing. And that's a lot less interesting than crash retrievals. "But I try to look at it from, let's say you're a Pentagon insider and you are trying to fight for an opening in the public conversation. You're not gonna start with crash retrievals. First of all, you may not have the receipts on them yourself, to provide to the public. And also you're gonna know, right off the bat, that that's going to be a bigger hill to climb than just trying to get Congress to look at some of the more easily-verifiable reports that you probably have available. So, you're probably going to take it in a very tactical, strategic way. "That's not the same thing as saying that they're lying. It could simply be that was a strategy that was decided upon by these insiders. It's also possible they may not have believed in an uncontrolled, catastrophic disclosure. We can disagree with them on that, or you can agree with them on that. But again, I don't know that that's the same thing as saying that they're actually being dishonest. "If the factional thesis that I believe in is correct, then you'd have to assume that these people have to have their strategies and tactics in this broader struggle. Like, it would be ridiculous not to assume that. "So, I think, you know, it's entirely possible that someone like Elizondo has elements in his background that we would want to know about that are not there. It is very intriguing, and even plausible, perhaps, that someone like Clapper belongs somewhere in this deeper history. I would like to know what that is myself, and I would like to see something, you know, in the way of what we would call genuine evidence for that. Not saying it's not there. "I'm just suggesting that the current theory on Elizondo and controlled disclosure is asking us to accept several unsupported links, and, essentially, I would say a disclosure strategy that appears self-defeating and really illogical. Again, like, why initiate a disclosure program? Especially if you go back to the beginning of the AATIP era, like 2009-ish, 2010. Where was there any perceived need that we have to do disclosure?" (Not sure why Richard is not calling the 2009-ish, 2010-era, AAWSAP. I wonder if he knows that Stratton says he created AATIP in 2015? Could be relevant to this controversy.) Dolan: "Like, I look back at the situation at that time, and again, I was very, very on top of the scene at that time during those years, and I just was not aware of any public pressure, whatsoever, that would cause someone to say, 'We have to initiate a controlled disclosure of this, in order to protect crash retrievals.' "There's no logic there, it seems to me. It's, in fact, the exact opposite. "Also, the the current hypothesis, I think, really understates Elizondo's 2019 acknowledgement of recovered UFO material. That really has got to be understood. And it leaves the whole Pentagon campaign against Elizondo, in my view, anyway, largely unresolved and unexplained, and really not making sense. "And, I would just add, now that I'm thinking of it, this current hypothesis about Lue Elizondo, I think, actually reverses the the genuine historical sequence. In other words, I am suggesting that Elizondo probably helped to create the opening that allowed Grusch to go even further. "So, these are just logical questions that I have. You may have different questions. You may have rebuttals to what I have to say here. By all means, put them in a comment, I will read them. And again, I'm not here to defend Lue Elizondo, I am just questioning an account that does not yet, in my view, explain its own logic, or match the full chronology. "It is entirely possible that some of this story is well-known to researchers, including Gerb. I think, however, what has been presented so far does not show how all the pieces actually fit together, and I would like to see that. "And again, I say this with total respect to UAP Gerb and to Ross Coulthart, and in fairness to Lue Elizondo, who I think, if nothing else, this aspect of the history really needs to be understood by the broader community. So that is my statement. "And that doesn't mean that I'm right here, but I do think from time-to-time, it's okay to take a stand on a topic where I can see many people are going to disagree with this, but certain things I think need to be understood on this, and I hope that we can have a reasoned dialogue and discussion about this as we move forward with it, because it is a topic that we do need to understand. "My hypothesis has, pretty much, from the beginning, always been that what we are seeing and what we have been seeing since 2017 is, essentially, the result of a factional battle." (I believe Lue spoke about factions early on when he first went public.) "You go back through the history of this phenomenon, and if you read the old books going back to the 1950s, you see it then, too. You see that there were always factions within the Pentagon who did actually support some level of openness on the UFO subject. "You read the books of Donald Keyhoe, read the book by Edward Ruppelt from 1956: 'Report on Unidentified Flying Objects.' A lot of this is in there. And I think that's really never gone away. And so to somehow assume that there are no more factions in a massive labyrinthian structure as large as the U.S. military industrial complex, I think that's kind of ridiculous. There's always going to be factions. And I think that what we are seeing has always struck me as the result of a factional war that is taking place. "And that doesn't mean, by the way, that, you know, the two sides are just white hats and black hats. Everyone's got their own angle, everyone's got their own motivations. But I, nevertheless, tend to think that that is what we are looking at."](https://image.24vids.com/tw-2084538028572430772/amplify_video_thumb/2084536612109860864/img/9DvVsfAYTKl5EUNt.jpg)