The doctrine Protestants (apparently) can't defend

OSAS is the Arminian doctrine. Perseverance of the Saints is the Reformed doctrine. Ryan needs to do his homework. On the former, once I make a free choice, God is obligated to save me no matter what I do, which entails a form of Antinomianism which the Reformers rejected. On the latter, God causes me to continue in faith and obedience generally speaking to the end of my life and thereafter. That Ryan doesn't seem to know the difference might explain why he is so out of step with the Reformation on other matters. People need to find better teachers.

Your response is an unfalsifiable theory. Saying those who fall away were never really saved is a "No true Scotsman" fallacy.

Schrodinger’s Christian: “if they fell away, they weren’t really Christian.” Guess all those warnings of falling away and failing to keep the faith and the encouragement to persevere and “finish the race” are just hot air.

This is what make Christianity different from all the other religions, it is a GIFT. « The Righetous shall live by faith » We are not saved by good works; we are saved unto good works. So good works aren’t the root of salvation they’re the fruit of genuine saving faith.

i can’t spam the internet enough about this. OSAS is a demonic doctrine. there are about 30 ways to Sunday that the Bible describes being saved and then choosing not to stay on the path. -wandering from the path -willfully sinning -having dead faith -being a lukewarm believer -being blotted out of the book of life -departing from the living God -if you don’t forgive others YOUR father won’t forgive you (God is your father if you are a believer) -if you take the mark of the beast -if a righteous person turns from their righteousness and commits sin … None of the righteous things will be remembered. -“Not everyone who says to me, ‘Lord, Lord,’ will enter the kingdom of heaven, but only the one who does the will of my Father who is in heaven.” -those who do not obey the gospel will be eternally punished with destruction we must have faith, be DOERS of the word and endure until the end

He needs to worry about his own salvation. The disciples walked with Jesus and failed him until the Baptism of Fire. Read up on the New Covenant. Might learn something.

His question never said that you don’t or can’t know whom you believe in lol. He’s saying that, since the same way you know whom you believe in and claim you have an absolute certainty that you can never fall away, that someone thought EXACTLY the same way 10 years ago, with the exact same reasons as you but ended up falling away. What makes you different from this person? How do you know you won’t end up the same way? And if your proof of a genuine believer is that he will persevere till the end, doesn’t that then mean that in your theology, you will never know if you are a genuine believer until the end? You claim it’s wrong to ask a believer to look at the way they live (their sins/obedience) in order to know if they are in Christ. But Scripture teaches exactly that: “This is how we know we are in him: Whoever claims to live in him must live as Jesus did.” (1 John 2:6) “We know that we have come to know him if we keep his commands.” (1 John 3:14) “Anyone who does not do what is right is not God’s child, nor is anyone who does not love their brother and sister.” (1 John 3:10) None of the verses you cited says that it’s impossible for a once saved, genuine believer to be cut off from Christ. Yes, God will and is able to keep you till the end but Scripture is clear that it is conditional (nothing in those verses says it is not). If you reject His grace and don’t bear fruit, He will cut you off: “He cuts off every branch in me that bears no fruit” (1 John 15:2) “continue in his kindness. Otherwise, you also will be cut off.” (Rom. 11:22) “those who live like this will not inherit the kingdom of God.” (Gal 5:21) (Scripture for example says God will supply all your needs (Phil 4:19). But the same scripture says, “The one who is unwilling to work shall not eat.” (2 Thess 3:10). God’s supply is conditioned in our willingness to work) 1 John 2:19 does NOT say that the departure of the Antichrists shows they were *never* of us. It says that it shows that they were “not of us” i.e their current state prior to departure. (they were *not* of us and they were *never* of us are two different sentences with totally different meanings). The verse allows the possibility that they genuinely believed and loved God at the beginning before it grew cold as Christ says will happen to many: “Because of the increase of wickedness, the love of most will grow cold, but the one who stands firm to the end will be saved.” (Matt 24:12-13) “They believe for a while, but in the time of testing they fall away.” (Luke 8:13) (Notice Christ did NOT say they *claim* to believe but that “they believe for a while”. Again 2 different meanings) Also, John just 5 verses later in the same chapter: “see that what you have heard from the beginning remains in you. If it does, you also will remain in the Son and in the Father.” (1 John 2:24) John 6:47 “whoever believes has eternal life” does NOT say that the eternal life will not be received from Christ (who chose to give it in baptism) nor that the believer can never stop believing to forfeit the eternal life. (those are your assertions) I don’t know how you got “once saved, always saved” in Hebrews 3:14 when it is explicitly saying the opposite lol: “We have come to share in Christ, if indeed we hold our original conviction firmly to the very end.” Scriptural warnings are real because they are possible. Anyone teaching otherwise is an agent of Satan:

Full video:

The RCC cant have believers have assurance of salvation because it strips them of authority and power they so strongly lust after.

John 5:24 6:47 3:16 = 1 John 5:13 ✅ we know we have eternal life ✔️

It's so clear when people haven't read their word. Isaiah Clearly said that we are transgressors from the womb. God already knows our hearts. Ryan spot on. We love God be cause He FIRST loved us. Not the other way around.

This is awesome. Praise be to God.

Osas is perseverance of the saints for dumbies. It's an attempt by evangelicals to muscle in on tulip while rejecting other tenants of tulip.

The cherry picking here is next level

Hallelujah

Can't defend? Did God say no to Jesus' prayer in John 17:9-11; 20-24? John 6:40,47; 10:26-29; 1 John 5:12-13 See also Eph. 4:30; 2 Cor. 1:20-22; Phil. 1:6; Col. 1:3-6 Catholics don't seem to know what 'eternal life' means. Rom. 11:29

Why do we always ask if a Christian can lose their salvation and not; "Can Jesus can lose a Christian?"

By Karl Keating, not me: PERILOUSLY CLOSE TO THE CATHOLIC POSITION Many years go--not in a galaxy far, far away but at a parish in Southern California--I gave an apologetical talk, after which everyone exited to the patio for some afternoon conviviality. The audience hadn't been exclusively Catholic. A few Protestants attended too. One of them was a young man who came up to me in the patio and denied my denial of "once saved, always saved." I answered by means of a hypothetical. I asked him to imagine someone about his age who, when he had turned 20, had a "born again" experience. That hypothetical man became a serious Christian, attended an Evangelical seminary, and by 25 was the assistant pastor at a thriving church. By age 35 he was the pastor. Through these years and thirty more he lived a truly exemplary life. Neither he nor his family nor any member of the congregation could find substantial moral fault in anything he did. In all ways he was the ideal pastor. On the day he turned 65, things changed--not because of any mental infirmity on his part but through his free will. On that day he committed adultery, stole a car, deliberately ran over a child in a crosswalk, robbed a bank, was in a shootout with the police, and took his own life, cursing God as he did so and dying unrepentent. I asked my interlocutor where that man went--to heaven or hell? "To hell, obviously," he said. "But he was a born-again Christian, so, by your lights, he must have gone to heaven, right?" "He couldn't have been a born-again Christian. No born-again Christian would sin like that. The man went to hell." "But as I told you at the beginning of the story, he was a born-again Christian." "And I told you that he couldn't have been." "In other words," I said, "everyone around him--and he himself--believed that he was a born-again Christian who was guaranteed to go to heaven, yet, by your principles, he never could have been one in actuality, right?" "Right." "Do you realize how perilously close to the Catholic position you are? What you're saying is that we can't know if someone is bound for heaven until he is safely dead, because he could throw everything away at the end, undoing all the good of his earlier life." "Huh?" "You can't tell whether someone really has been born again, in your sense of the term, until he has died, and that means that your 'assurance of salvation' is nothing of the sort. You can't be assured of something today if you have to wait decades to learn, at the end, that your supposed assurance was well grounded." The young man paused, thanked me, and walked away.

This doesn't address the question though. The hypothetical fallen-away believer believed the same things and had the same assurances and the same passages to quote from. He's really only saying, "because I'm me, idiot. Duh."

God JUDGES, He alone determines if your faith is genuine

Everyone needs to read the Bible for themselves. Stop relying on others to teach you. God is everywhere and hears our prayers. He gives grace to the humble.

The difference? The renewing of your heart and mind by christ. Only god knows whats in our hearts. Add in the calvinist perspective, and those people who left, they never believed sufficiently to be chosen and renewed in christ. God knew they’d fall away and withheld it.

The Holy Spirit

You can absolutely fall from Grace. Read the last lines in the Bible. "Anyone who takes away from the words contained in this Book will have their name stricken from the lambs book of life"

None of this calling out "protestants" means anything to be because I do not adopt earthly titles. I am a follower of The Way, none of these man-made titles fit my relationship with Christ. I only accept scriptures titles for His people.

Osas goes against perseverance of the Saints as you explain it because I have to always have faith. Osas if I had faith I am saved, if I lose faith I’m not always saved

Ask Noah if he is Vaccinated. If he is, he never had faith.

I thought this guy was an evangelical.

You’re just not getting it, there’s been countless people who were just as sure in their faith as you are, but… fell away.

No it's not perseverance of the saints, that's an equivocation. Osas is just you can't loose your salvation, pots is i will continue to show fruit of the spirit, because if i don't i was never really saved 🤷‍♂️

Bruh, you’re not a Protestant. All the Protestant reformers would have considered you a heretic, and you disagree with fundament tenants of reformation groups, such as infant baptism for example.

The argument cites God’s faithfulness, then assumes a justified Christian 𝗰𝗮𝗻𝗻𝗼𝘁 later reject grace. That is the point needing proof. 𝗖𝗹𝗮𝗶𝗺 𝟭: “Genuine believers always persevere.” That restates OSAS. Paul says: “𝗬𝗼𝘂 𝘀𝘁𝗮𝗻𝗱 𝗳𝗮𝘀𝘁 𝗼𝗻𝗹𝘆 𝘁𝗵𝗿𝗼𝘂𝗴𝗵 𝗳𝗮𝗶𝘁𝗵…otherwise you too will be cut off” (Rom 11:20–22). He does not say, “If cut off, you were never truly grafted in.” They presently stand by faith and can still be cut off. Hebrews warns “brethren” against an unbelieving heart causing them to “𝗳𝗮𝗹𝗹 𝗮𝘄𝗮𝘆 𝗳𝗿𝗼𝗺 𝘁𝗵𝗲 𝗹𝗶𝘃𝗶𝗻𝗴 𝗚𝗼𝗱” (Heb 3:12). 𝗖𝗹𝗮𝗶𝗺 𝟮: Philippians 1:6 proves unconditional perseverance. No. Paul expresses confidence that God will complete His work, but also commands: “𝗪𝗼𝗿𝗸 𝗼𝘂𝘁 𝘆𝗼𝘂𝗿 𝗼𝘄𝗻 𝘀𝗮𝗹𝘃𝗮𝘁𝗶𝗼𝗻 with fear and trembling; for God is at work in you” (Phil 2:12–13). God supplies grace; believers must persevere. 𝗖𝗹𝗮𝗶𝗺 𝟯: “I know whom I have believed” answers the challenge. It does not. The question is not whether you know whom you presently trust. It is how you know with infallible certainty that your present faith 𝗺𝘂𝘀𝘁 persevere until death. Paul’s confidence does not establish that. He says: “Let anyone who thinks that he stands 𝘁𝗮𝗸𝗲 𝗵𝗲𝗲𝗱 𝗹𝗲𝘀𝘁 𝗵𝗲 𝗳𝗮𝗹𝗹” (1 Cor 10:12). 𝗖𝗹𝗮𝗶𝗺 𝟰: 1 John 2:19 proves every apostate was never saved. John speaks about particular defectors. OSAS turns that into a universal rule he never states. Hebrews 6 describes people “once enlightened,” who “tasted the heavenly gift,” “became partakers of the Holy Spirit,” and then 𝗳𝗲𝗹𝗹 𝗮𝘄𝗮𝘆. Calling that “superficial faith” assumes OSAS beforehand. 𝗖𝗹𝗮𝗶𝗺 𝟱: “If someone fails to persevere, his faith was never genuine.” That is circular. Genuine believers always persevere because anyone who does not was never genuine; he was never genuine because genuine believers persevere. Jesus instead says: “They 𝗯𝗲𝗹𝗶𝗲𝘃𝗲 𝗳𝗼𝗿 𝗮 𝘄𝗵𝗶𝗹𝗲 and in time of temptation 𝗳𝗮𝗹𝗹 𝗮𝘄𝗮𝘆” (Luke 8:13). 𝗖𝗹𝗮𝗶𝗺 𝟲: John 6:47 proves eternal security. “Whoever believes has eternal life.” Amen. But Jesus also commands: “𝗔𝗯𝗶𝗱𝗲 𝗶𝗻 𝗺𝗲” (John 15:4), and warns: “If a man does not abide in me, he is cast forth” (John 15:6). OSAS turns 𝗶𝗻 𝗖𝗵𝗿𝗶𝘀𝘁 → fails to abide → removed into “never really in Christ.” Jesus did not. 𝗖𝗹𝗮𝗶𝗺 𝟳: “Living righteously doesn’t play a part in getting us to heaven.” Scripture says: “Strive for…𝗵𝗼𝗹𝗶𝗻𝗲𝘀𝘀 𝘄𝗶𝘁𝗵𝗼𝘂𝘁 𝘄𝗵𝗶𝗰𝗵 𝗻𝗼 𝗼𝗻𝗲 𝘄𝗶𝗹𝗹 𝘀𝗲𝗲 𝘁𝗵𝗲 𝗟𝗼𝗿𝗱” (Heb 12:14). Paul warns grave sinners “will not inherit the kingdom of God” (1 Cor 6:9–10). This is not earning salvation apart from grace. It is grace transforming us in faith working through love. 𝗧𝗵𝗲 𝗽𝗿𝗼𝗯𝗹𝗲𝗺 𝗳𝗼𝗿 𝗢𝗦𝗔𝗦: Scripture warns Christians about what OSAS says cannot happen: “you too will be cut off” (Rom 11:22); “take heed lest he fall” (1 Cor 10:12); “you have fallen away from grace” (Gal 5:4); “if we deny him, he also will deny us” (2 Tim 2:12). Catholicism does not deny preserving grace. 𝗣𝗲𝗿𝘀𝗲𝘃𝗲𝗿𝗮𝗻𝗰𝗲 𝗶𝘁𝘀𝗲𝗹𝗳 𝗶𝘀 𝗮 𝗴𝗶𝗳𝘁 𝗼𝗳 𝗴𝗿𝗮𝗰𝗲. But grace can be resisted. God saves and supplies every grace needed to endure. Christ’s command remains: 𝗥𝗘𝗠𝗔𝗜𝗡 𝗜𝗡 𝗛𝗜𝗠.

Lies. It’s called assured salvation and it’s bullshiit

You are a faggot.