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Chris Williamson & Andrew Huberman break down why sleep is your ultimate reset—and how to protect it even after rough nights. Key takeaways: - One or two bad nights? Your body bounces back—evolved for extremes (new parents know!). Chronic issues come from disrupted cortisol curves (late-day spikes that linger).... show more
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![Vallée and the Closed System: Are We Prisoners? 🧠👽 Vallée: "Are We Being Taken Over by a Species from Somewhere in Space That's Vastly More Intelligent Than We Are?" 👽🧠 "..the simulation...was a new concept that I initially rejected." ~Vallée "Is it looking for us to try to interact with it as equals or with parity?" ~Scafish "Nobody says that to Congress, and I think Congress should hear it." ~Vallée If, "it's a closed system, we're like prisoners and something is going to happen to us, and there is very little we can do." ~Vallée Turn the thermostat dial. "If the temperature doesn't change, then I know I'm inside a control system. So, we can do the same thing with UFOs, but we have to react. We have to, number one, acknowledge that it exists, and number two, we have to react to it." ~Vallée ~~~ I've been wanting to share this one for a while... Vallée: "So, he said, the question you have to ask about UFOs is, number one, is it a natural system or an artificial system...control system. And if it is a control system, is it open or closed? In other words, are we being taken over by a species from somewhere in space that's vastly more intelligent than we are?" (I've never heard him even suggest that possibility.) Vallée: "You know, as Dr. Garry P. Nolan says, you know, people who have had ten, you know, scientific revolutions, or a hundred or a thousand, and come here with superior science to do something... And in which case, you know, it's a closed system, we're like prisoners and something is going to happen to us, and there is very little we can do. Or, is it an open system where we can, in fact, communicate with it. And if we can communicate with it, then the question for me as an information scientist is, what are the modalities of the interaction, you know? It's not just can we learn their language? And they say, you know, 'We come in peace to save mankind,' or something. Or 'We will give you the cure for cancer' or something. I don't think it's at that level." (Will we ever be able to get answers to these extremely important questions? If it's an open system, how do we communicate with it? How do we provoke it to react? We know it reacts to anything nuclear but we still don't know why. This is why we need the USG (and other governments) to present evidence that shows the masses this is real and extremely important for our species to investigate. If that evidence exists and is shown, we'll have an easier time getting the world's best minds to join the effort in figuring out the best way to answer these questions. We still may fail but we should at least try.) Vallée: "I think it's a meta-system. It's not a system. And that's my fear...if we can circle back to your earlier question about, you know, about NIDS and about BAASS, what we did for the government and what we did for the Defense Intelligence Agency. Half of the budget was spent developing, you know, a super database. And we don't know where it went. I mean, I'm not cleared to know where it went." (On the contractor (BAASS) side, Bigelow should have all copies of what AAWSAP produced. And on the DIA side, Lacatksi said he put all of the digital files in a specific place that he didn't name. As long as someone didn't delete it all, it should still be there. Vallée has said that the Capella database has about 250,000 cases from around the world.) Vallée: "But that would be a very interesting question, because the people who are getting [the database] are getting raw data, which we have very well organized, all in English. So they have the luxury of, you know, we had five translators from French, English, Portuguese, Russian, you know, everything was translated in a single structure across fourteen databases. "That's what we need to answer the question about the control system, and it's not being done. And we hired a whole team that we had trained to work on it. So to rebuild that will take the next ten or fifteen years. And nobody says that to Congress, and I think Congress should hear it, because it's our money." (As long as names and personal details are scrubbed from that database, there is no reason NOT to release it to the public. This way, we can take it and use AI to help decipher patterns and maybe answer some of these questions. Can Congress help us get access to that database?) Vallée: "When you ask, is it a control system? That's a big question." Peter Scafish Peter Skafish - "You asked, at one point, whether the system is open or closed, and you said, additionally, I believe, if it's open, that it would be possible to communicate back to it. And it sounds to me like that's the key question for you. Is, if you can understand what what the system of symbols is, or the modalities of communication, then you can understand enough to engage in some kind of communication, or at least give some kind of response to show that you understand." Vallée: "Yes." Scafish: "So then the question, and we have a member named Jacqueline, who has asked this. Could the system be stimulating us - provided there is such a system - to interact with it, more as subjects or agents than as something like animals or objects? Is it looking for us to try to interact with it as equals or with parity?" (When people report getting injured or sick from being in close proximity to UAP, it suggests to me that the phenomenon won't go out of its way to avoid affecting us in a negative manner if we get in their its/way (assuming it even knows that close encounters with UAP are not good for humans). Kind of like how we treat lower lifeforms. If we encounter a wild rabbit crossing the road, many of us will do our best to avoid it, but not if it means damaging our car or ourselves in an accident. It may ruin our day if we hit it, but it won't stop us from driving again in the future. Do NHI have bad days if their tech injures us or makes us sick? I have no clue.) Vallée: "Well, what I saw in the notes you gave me, is she was also asking: Is it a control system because we think it is? And that's a very interesting question. Because we react to the UFO phenomenon, or the UAP phenomenon. And, you know, at this point when I think about what I'm going to do next in this research, if I'm given the the opportunity to live a little longer, I'm not going to go back and write any more computer programs. There are better people to do that now, they have the data, and we're in a different phase now. We're in a whole different system. I have the luxury of doing some experiments I wanted to do for a long time." (Would have liked Scafish to ask him: What types of experiments?) Vallée: "So, if you think you are inside the control system, there are things that you can do. Or, if you think you're inside the simulation, you know, which was a new concept that I initially rejected, and then, you know, Ray's (Kurzweil?) work and others have brought it back to the forefront. And we have to ask that at the same time. Can we test it? How would you test it? Well, if, you know, I'm here in my apartment, and the temperature is constant in this apartment. But outside, I can see it's cold, or I can see the sun is out and it's warm, and how come it's constant here? So this would lead me to think that there is a control system, namely a thermostat, that is somewhere. "So I can start looking around the walls, and if I see dial, I can turn it, or I could start a fire and see what happens, see if the temperature changes. If the temperature doesn't change, then I know I'm inside a control system. So, we can do the same thing with UFOs, but we have to react. We have to, number one, acknowledge that it exists, and number two, we have to react to it."](https://image.24vids.com/tw-1999241328388112749/amplify_video_thumb/1999240752300498944/img/-ITml6B_VyoovXQH.jpg)
![Just in $AMD Anush "Speed is the moat"|ROCm🎙️ In the race to define the future of AI, what's the one advantage that truly lasts? It's not proprietary tech, argues Anush Elangovan Elangovan, VP of AI Software at AMD , but the sustainable speed of innovation. He explains why AMD is rejecting the "walled garden" model for its open source ROCm stack, betting that an open community flywheel is the key to victory. Listen to understand how this open strategy is designed to out-innovate closed systems by empowering developers to solve everything from frontier-model challenges to the mundane, everyday problems that define the "last mile" of AI. AMD ROCm Software: Part 1 Transcript [00:00:00] Andrew Zigler: Joining me is Anush Elangovan, VP of AI software at AMD. And when people talk about AI compute, the conversation often stops at hardware specs, but it's more than just physical chips that win the game. It's also the software ecosystems supporting them. [00:00:18] Andrew Zigler: The prevailing strategy in the industry has been to build something like a walled garden. You know, something closed, proprietary locks, developers in. But AMD is betting on an entirely different play, open source acceleration, and with rock, their open source AI software stack. AMD is building not just hardware parity, but an innovation flywheel that's powered by the community with interoperability and the freedom to scale without all of that pesky lockin. [00:00:48] Andrew Zigler: And in this world, speed is your moat and how fast you can innovate while your platform remains open, flexible, and standardize across all of its applications. That's what we're gonna explore [00:01:00] today. So Anush, I'm really excited to have you here. Welcome to Dev Interrupted. [00:01:04] Anush Elangovan: Thanks for having me. Uh, super excited to chat about it. [00:01:07] Andrew Zigler: Amazing. Well, let's go ahead and dive right in with kind of what I laid it out with in the beginning, the idea of the moat and it being about speed. I wanna unpack that a bit because that came from you when you and I first spoke. And I, and I want to know, you know, how do you define speed inside of AMD beyond just things like hardware, benchmarks. [00:01:27] Anush Elangovan: Yeah, that's a very good question. So when we typically talk about speed, everyone's like, Hey, hardware benchmark specs, right? Like, uh, memory bandwidth or, or flops. And that is one important part of it, uh, AMD does very well. With that, we do have, a, a very good history of executing on that axis. [00:01:47] Anush Elangovan: But when I say speed is the moat, it is about, uh, how we prepare, how we build the muscle to run the race for a long time and run it fast. And it is [00:02:00] not about a single point in time that you've, you've beat some you know, benchmark and, and you declare victory. It's about building the ability to consistently develop and deliver. [00:02:13] Anush Elangovan: Both hardware and software innovation at scale and do it fast, right? Like, you know, we we're increasingly getting to a point where models come out and they're, uh, you know, a year or two ago it was like, Hey, they work on AMD on day zero, which is great, but now they are performing on AMD the day it releases, right? [00:02:32] Anush Elangovan: So, what does it take to Prefetch where the industry is going? Be prepared to intercept. At that point is what you know, I, I refer to as you know, the, the speed factor in, in creating this mode, right? And the mode is just shed all things that hold you back and run as fast as you can. [00:02:53] Anush Elangovan: Uh, because the pace of innovation that is, uh, being seen in, in AI [00:03:00] industries is just. Amazing. Right? And it's like, it's transformational at at how you generate electricity. It's transformational as at how you build data centers. It's transformational at how you deploy compute, networking. It's transformational at what kind of use cases you, you know, uh, use AI for. [00:03:17] Anush Elangovan: Uh, and for that, you need to be prepared to, see what comes tomorrow and be prepared to run the race tomorrow. [00:03:23] Andrew Zigler: Yeah, it's a really great perspective because it highlights that it's not just like a checkpoint that you run through. I like how you called out, like it's not just hitting that benchmark or being the best in class at that moment, in that snapshot, it's about having a. The throughput and about having that dedication to the idea and continuing to deliver on it. [00:03:43] Andrew Zigler: It's not just crossing the threshold, but it's also being the engine. And that's what, that's what protects a business. That is the moat, because the moat is that innovation layer, the faster and more, uh, future forward. That you can work and think, [00:04:00] you know, the better. Uh, we, we talk a lot about like future forward work styles. [00:04:04] Andrew Zigler: Like what are the things I could be doing right now today that are gonna be like, way more useful tomorrow? Let, let's abandon those, workflows that are older and that kind of like, that translates into. An advantage when you work that way. You know, what kind of things have you learned working with, uh, like across all spectrums of people who would use ROCm, right? [00:04:23] Andrew Zigler: You have like the developers, but then you also have the enterprises and you have this large span of adoptees, right? So what is the, what does that look like that you learn? [00:04:32] Anush Elangovan: Yeah, so, so the way I look at it is there are gonna be pockets of different, uh, you know, cadences, right? Like, so people who are deploying in enterprises, for example, right? The validation and how long it takes for them to deploy an LLM that's secure. It's, with guardrails, et cetera, maybe longer. [00:04:52] Anush Elangovan: but you still have to go through the process and you have to be prepared to like, walk that walk to deploy an enterprises. That doesn't mean it's [00:05:00] not fast, that's as fast as you can do for that industry, right? And if you are deploying AI in healthcare, right, it's, it's got its own, uh, cycle. [00:05:07] Anush Elangovan: but in each one of these, you want to see how, like, go down to the essence of what is it that you actually have to do. And, you know, I, I, I like how you framed it. It's like it's, you shed your prior assumptions of how things are done, right. And, and you kind of build up from a, uh, first principles, uh, approach to say, this is how I could use AI to unlock, whatever I'm doing. [00:05:33] Anush Elangovan: And, and, some of it, you know, it's good to really step back and look at. Just question every part of it, right? Like right now you're getting chat GPT and, Gemini competing for like, math, olympiads and, and, uh, college, uh, reasoning, uh, tests. Right? And, and those are like that, that is amazing and increasingly like complex tasks that they're trying to do. [00:05:58] Anush Elangovan: But there may also be like. [00:06:00] More mundane things that AI could, could get applied to. Right? And, and so when we think about shedding old ways, you wanna shed it not just in like the tip of the spear. It's like, you know, I'm gonna see what's the frontier model. It's also, it could be something as simple as. [00:06:18] Anush Elangovan: How do you choose a, a movie, uh, you know, like a recommendation system, right? Or, or, uh, an automated, uh, flight, uh, rebooking system. So the moment, you know, your flight is late, uh, right now it's a notification, right? It's like, oh, you got a text message saying your flight's late. And I got that like three times this week. [00:06:38] Anush Elangovan: But anyway, uh, and, and, and, and, I was just like, okay, so if I were to rethink this. All this MCPs that we have that should be hooked up into an MCP that says, your flight's delayed. Here are your options. If you want, you know, these are the paid options. Yeah. Here are the free options. This will get you back into your you know, Toronto airport [00:07:00] tonight. [00:07:00] Anush Elangovan: Or if you stay, here's a hotel plus this, plus this, plus. It's just like, go ahead is all I should say. Versus now I'm like, okay, can someone, you know, can I call a travel agent? Can I do this? Can I go online and log into And you know, so we gotta fundamentally rethink even those like small, nuances of, things that we do that can be automated out and AI is really, really good at doing something like this, right? Maybe I just explained an AI startup idea right now. Somebody should just start that. [00:07:29] Andrew Zigler: I think you did. Yeah, you definitely did. Someone, one of our listeners is definitely going to lift that off of you. I, I, I, you know, I hate being on the receiving end of those. You feel a little helpless and then you have to like, follow the whole flow. So I know what you mean. Like I, I like how you called out that the build and this like. [00:07:45] Andrew Zigler: Where speed is your moat and the innovation layer is protecting you, is what makes you better than your competitors. How you scale that and you bring that to market. So by understanding the problems that you're solving, uh, throwing away those older assumptions, but also [00:08:00] recognizing that like. We're building every single day, new things and new ways of using stuff that we're still figuring out the implications of. [00:08:08] Andrew Zigler: And so when you have a lot of velocity and you're introducing a lot of new ideas, and maybe you have that workflow now that automatically rebook your flight off of your late flight text message, and uh, I know I would certainly use it, but you know, what kind of philosophies guide the way that y'all think about building this ecosystem to manage that stability while letting folks. [00:08:29] Andrew Zigler: Play with the speed and the assumptions and the airplane re bookings. [00:08:34] Anush Elangovan: so, so I think, you know, we need to peel one layer down, right? and the philosophy is, Hey, we, we just discovered electricity, right? And you know what we're gonna do? We are gonna make motors, uh, or dynamos, right? Like engines. Uh, sure. We don't know if it's gonna be a Ferrari that you're gonna make, or it's a a a a dump truck. [00:08:57] Anush Elangovan: That's good for doing this. But let's [00:09:00] let, which is also required, right? You need a dump truck. You need a garbage truck. And, [00:09:04] Andrew Zigler: Yeah. You need the [00:09:04] Anush Elangovan: course you need, uh, a Ferrari for a midlife crisis, right? So, [00:09:09] Andrew Zigler: precisely. [00:09:10] Anush Elangovan: But, but my, uh, point is what do we build next? And, uh, and this is what I meant by like, okay, let's, let's take those baby steps to build the. [00:09:20] Anush Elangovan: Infrastructure that's required that we know we'll have to use, right? So, so if I just discovered electricity, okay, great. Now one, how do I save this electricity and how do I use it? So there's battery technology, so you need to do something like that, right? Like so. But then you also want to make it into an actionable thing. [00:09:37] Anush Elangovan: You want to make it for like automobiles, or you wanna use it for, you know, powering, uh, entire cities. So it is that transformational. So, uh, AI is that transformational. So, if you distill down, it'll, it'll come down to how do we think about, what we can do with this this fundamental technology that, We may not be aware of what it [00:10:00] is gonna unlock next, but at least you know the next step is clear, right? It's like a dense fog, you know, it's gonna be like, it, it's the right path. You see the light, but it's kind of like out there and, and the steps you're taking are concrete and you're like, okay, this is good. [00:10:16] Anush Elangovan: I, this is better than where I was or where we were. So we are moving forward. So you can build with the. Intuition from what you see in the short term and a tactical view, but towards what you think the future is gonna be. [00:10:28] Andrew Zigler: Right. You almost like we're all in this like fog of war, right? And like you said, you're reaching out and you're trying to step through it. You could think of it too, as like you're in the dark and your hands are up in front of you and you know that. You're, you're not gonna run your face into a wall because your hands are out in front of you, but you're not gonna maybe do much better than that. [00:10:45] Andrew Zigler: So that's kind of like, I think the eco, the, the industry, the world that we find ourselves in, uh, and we all have to, then this becomes the power of an ecosystem, of a group of people working together to create that layer of, [00:11:00] uh, of establishing the [00:11:01] Anush Elangovan: exactly. And I, I, I just, instead of, you know, saying fog of war I describe it as like, you're in this. Beautiful valley with like a morning, uh, fog that's in. You can smell the flowers. You, you hear the birds. You are like, okay, it's, we are in like, uh, utopian paradise and yes, I just need to like, continue the walk, right? [00:11:24] Anush Elangovan: and then move forward with that, conviction that you're in the right spot. [00:11:27] Andrew Zigler: Yeah. So let's talk about that ecosystem world. This nice, I love how you describe it, this grassy side of a hill in the morning that's covered in some mist and maybe we can't see 30 feet in one direction, but it sure is a beautiful hill and it smells nice. And so we're all here. And why is, in that world, why is. [00:11:44] Andrew Zigler: You know, open source, their strategic advantage that y'all are going for in the AI hardware market. And, and then how does like ROCm turn that into wins for people within that ecosystem? [00:11:56] Anush Elangovan: you know, the, the way we look at it is this, is kind of like how I view [00:12:00] AI and the ecosystem, right? But, but it is for everyone to enjoy. Uh, and so we do want to make sure that. You know, it is, uh, beneficial for everyone. [00:12:09] Anush Elangovan: The ecosystem can come in and, and innovate. It's an open innovation engine. and uh, it is very different from, you know, having a walled garden with, Hey, only I know how to do this and I'm gonna do it and throw it over the fence and you can use it or keep walking, right? So we'd like to be good citizens that way, but also. [00:12:30] Anush Elangovan: Uh, it is self-fulfilling in a way, right? Like it, the, the pace at which we innovate with open source is unmatched. Like, you know, our serving engines are like VLLM and, and sg l. Those things, uh, those frameworks are like super, super aggressive in terms of how fast they come out with features and how fast they can you know, get performant models out. [00:12:52] Anush Elangovan: And that compared with what, uh, you'd get from, you know, the likes of like T-R-T-L-L-M or something is always lagging, right? Because you [00:13:00] just can't keep up with you know, 200 commits a week just on one particular model to get that model really performant [00:13:06] Andrew Zigler: And, and, and in that world where, you know, everyone can enjoy the winds of this, what kind of customer stories or innovation stories have really stood out to you and excite you about building and creating this place for developers? [00:13:19] Anush Elangovan: Yeah. So I think the parts that are super exciting for me are when when we get to see a customer that is first skeptical. Then they start a little like, okay, fine, we'll give you a chance. Uh, we do a simple, uh, POC and then they're like, huh, this seems to work. Yeah, we told you it works. [00:13:42] Anush Elangovan: You don't have to change one line of code. Really? Yes, no need to change one line of code. Okay, let's try a production workload. So then they try it. Oh, you're more performant than the competition. Yes. We're more performant than, than the competition. So how much does it cost? And we're like, oh, it's your TCO is better with, uh, [00:14:00] AMD. [00:14:00] Anush Elangovan: So again, they're like, wow, okay, good. So now how do we deploy at scale? And then we go deploy it at scale. And when they give a thumbs up on that and they say, this is good, right? That's when you know, you, you see it go full circle from like, oh, we, we've never heard about AMD to like actually deploy to tens of thousands of GPUs In the order of a few months, right? It, it, it really is fascinating to see and very exciting and invigorating to [00:14:28] Andrew Zigler: Yeah. At like a great exposure to a lot of interesting problems. And, and then people using the infrastructure, the, the technology available to solve those problems. Really specific problems by the way, that's often why they're bringing their data and AI to it, uh, is because it is really specific and important for them. [00:14:45] Andrew Zigler: And there's a, a lot I think that other engineering orgs can learn and even emulate from AMD's success and, and having this open source ecosystem and it causing this acceleration within. You [00:15:00] know, uh, customers and enterprises that use and adopt the tools and, and, and that creates an advantage. And that goes back to why we're talking and like the real thesis of our conversation today. [00:15:10] Andrew Zigler: So how do you think engineering leaders that are listening to this and obviously tapping into this great success AMD has from an open source flywheel, how do you think other, other folks building in the same space can foster that open, first, that open source oriented culture in order to, you know, accelerate their innovation goals? [00:15:29] Anush Elangovan: Yeah, that's a very good question. So the startup that um, was acquired by AMD we, we built, I mean, we started off doing iot stuff and you know, smart ring and all that, right? But in the, the end of like, uh, and not the end, the last six years of the company was building ML compilers. [00:15:47] Anush Elangovan: And ml, ML compilers are like super, uh, complicated, sophisticated, advanced algorithms, dah, dah, dah. but it was all open source, right? So our VCs were like, wait, what do you mean your core [00:16:00] IP is open source? And um, the speed is the moat applied even then, right? It was just like, yes, if you have an idea that. [00:16:08] Anush Elangovan: Because someone saw this idea that you are, they're gonna be able to catch up, then you probably have the wrong idea anyway. But if they are, you know, you execute and they're gonna catch up, that you should assume they're gonna catch up. Right? So you gotta move forward. So keeping it open source is super important. [00:16:25] Anush Elangovan: But also to your question on like, you know, the learnings from an AMD standpoint, right? If there are, hard problems, I'd say dig in and work through it, right? Like there's no way but through it, right? That should be the simple mentality. And more, uh, frequently than not. you'll see that you'll just make it through in a, in, in good form. [00:16:52] Anush Elangovan: But if you doubt it and you're like, oh, I don't know if I should commit, if I'm, I, you know, what should just commit to do the right thing [00:17:00] every step, right? Every step, and just keep taking one step in front of the other. And in no time you'll see that you'll be running. Right. And, and yes, the first few steps will be like, yeah, everyone's complaining about your software quality. [00:17:15] Anush Elangovan: Everyone's complaining about this and that, and it doesn't work. And, and a few steps in, you know, you get, you get the hang of all the complaints that are coming in. You get the feedback loop. You're like, okay, what, what are you prioritizing again? One step in front of the other, right? You just keep knocking that out and then you get to a point where you're, it just becomes second nature, right? To do the, to do the right thing. And, and then yes, if someone gives you two options, you'll be like, fine. This is, uh, you know, there's always the resource trade off. There's always a human capital trade off, but what's the right thing to do? of course, I, I'm pragmatic about what we choose, but, but if the right thing for your long-term success is dig in, go first, principles, make it [00:18:00] happen. [00:18:00] Anush Elangovan: Well. Then just go for that. There's, there is no shortcut to [00:18:04] Andrew Zigler: acknowledging, you know, how it aligns with your mission, your core company goals, and what you're looking to achieve. And, and I, I love how you rightfully called out that in the open source world and you know, you have your technology that you've built, what you think is your moat upon, right? [00:18:22] Andrew Zigler: It's your code and, and to open source that, or to just make it where anyone could peer in is, you know. Scary in one regard, but two, it just kind of feels like you're handing away your throne room in some kind of sense, a very direct feeling sense. But the ultimately, you were really right to call out, and this is something I think about all the time, that the real power there is still the speed This the speed. [00:18:42] Andrew Zigler: That was the moat at the beginning of our conversation. It's the speed in combination with your. Very specific domain understanding of what you're building and what you're creating, and your new role as the steward of that world and how people plug into it, which [00:19:00] has frankly, a lot more influence and power than lording over a closed. [00:19:04] Andrew Zigler: You know, repository or an ecosystem, and like you said, like throwing things over the wall. Sure. There, there might be people always on the other side of that wall, but you're not gonna have a great connection with them. You're not gonna be able to really clearly understand them. I, I like your metaphor of the side of the field of the mountain a lot more. [00:19:23] Andrew Zigler: But, but in the, in this world, you know, where. That speed is, is the power and, and open source is just one way that you can harness that speed to get really far ahead and to innovate. , There's other parts of this equation that you can be experimenting with too, and I'd love to pick your brain about them as a software leader and, and, and one of them is about looking forward and kind of understanding that future that we're all building towards and beyond today's models and hardware. [00:19:48] Andrew Zigler: You know, what do you see as the next major bottleneck or opportunity in the AI compute space? As, as you know, enterprises and folks start to get a little more mature about what's available to [00:20:00] them. [00:20:00] Anush Elangovan: Yeah, I think, the bottleneck and opportunity is, uh, what I'd call, call walking the last mile of ai. Right. Uh, and like I I, I gave you an example, uh, previously, but, but it's similar to that. It's like there are cases where Humans have so many, uh, things to do in your day. You know, like the, if we sit down and actually had a customer focus like, okay, these customers lives, I'm gonna save four hours of this customer's life. And if you actually sit down and look at all of that, it'll be. Easily automatable, easily you know, uh, applicable, uh, for ai, right? [00:20:39] Anush Elangovan: Like, but then making it happen is gonna take a little bit, right? It's like maybe it's, uh, paying your utility bill, right? Or something like that, right? Or, or, your healthcare explanation of benefits. Uh, like, I'm sure you get an explanation of benefits, and I'm like, I, I don't even know what that thing is. [00:20:55] Anush Elangovan: It's just like EOB and like. [00:20:57] Andrew Zigler: it's a big, a big old PDF. Yeah, [00:21:00] exactly. [00:21:01] Anush Elangovan: Like, like, I'm like great straight to the, uh, shredder, right? And but that could be, you know, automated with the ai, right? It, it, it'd be like, Hey, the summary of this thing is you went and visited this day. Everything is okay. Everything is paid for, so don't worry, it's not a bill. [00:21:17] Anush Elangovan: That again, the same, uh, thing, but the sense of what that information overload is could be. Digested by ai, uh, accumulated over time and retrieved when you need it. Like, I don't, I actually don't even need to know this EOB right now, unless of course, whenever I need to know it, that maybe, you know, like for some benefits I need to figure out what do, what did I do over the past year and how do I apply it? Source:](https://image.24vids.com/tw-1994972575768727743/amplify_video_thumb/1994972220930621440/img/_5CCZJyz89oDfqQJ.jpg)
![🤬 Burlison: Putting Lacatski Under Oath in a Hearing Wasn't a Top Priority Because He Wouldn't Say Anything New 🤬 (I can't believe I just heard that.) Jeremy Kenyon Lockyer Corbell: "Dr. James Lacatski came on our show. He ran the UFO program for the Defense Intelligence Agency, and he admitted on our show that they breached the hull of a UFO in government possession." Burlison at the Last Hearing: "You reported [that] James Lacatski came to you with government possession of NHI craft and how they ultimately gained entry. Can you testify to the veracity of that claim?" George Knapp at the Last Hearing: "Dr. Lacatski is an honorable man who served most of his career with the DIA. A very trusted, high-level rocket scientist and intelligence analyst who inspired the AAWSAP program, as I said earlier. He said this craft, we had managed to get inside of it. It had no wings, no rotor, no tail, it had no fuel, no fuel tanks. They didn't know how it flew or how it was operated. It clearly looked like it was aerodynamic, but he would not go further. He's a by-the-book guy, and until he gets clearance to say more about that, I don't think we're going to hear much more. "But, it's not ours. It wasn't ours. We didn't make it. We didn't know who made it and how it was built and how it operated. We've got at least one, and I don't know, I think that's enough confirmation that we do have recovered discs and material." (What is written in "Initial Revelations" about that alleged craft, and Lacatski standing by what was written when he was on "Weaponized" is one of the most important claims we've ever had in this field. I don't see it as confirmation that we have craft but we're getting closer. Lacatski saying that he saw it with his own eyes would take it up a notch, but I still wanna see it for myself, and not just in photos and videos. AI is just too good to accept that as proof.) Corbell: "So, and you put that in congressional record. Do you have a way that you can, you know, find out, where is it? He can't tell us, but maybe he can tell you? Where is that craft? Can you go hunt it down? Can you go see it?" Burlison: "You know, that's an interesting question. When it came to Lacatski - and I watched his interview that he did with you guys - and here's what my response to him is. Because he was frustrated that we hadn't reached out to him, but he also kind of, he also admitted that - which is what I was told, and the reason why we haven't reached out to him - is that he's not gonna tell us anything that's not in his books." (Most people on this planet have not read his books!) Corbell: "Well, hold on, hold on. You did reach out to him. There have been three hearings. I reached out to him on behalf of Congress, officially, twice, to say..." Burlison: "You did, that's right, you did." Corbell: "And I had congressional members talk with him the hearing before the last one. He just forgot. But the point is, is that maybe with you guys, in the correct environment, with the right clearances, he can tell you where it is, and you can just put this to bed and go find it." (I'm not against Congress talking to Lacatski in a SCIF, but, IMO, the chances that he tells members of the Secrets Task Force the location of this alleged craft are ZERO. Maybe Rubio would get an answer but he may already know. And if he (Rubio) does know, he's not telling us. At least not yet, and probably, IMO, never.) Burlison: "Yeah. And I remember that. I remember that he was one of the people that we had tasked you to go to reach out to. And for those people that are kind of asking how did that relationship work? Look, we don't have all the contact information for all these people. Why repeat the work that you two have done in building these contacts in your networks? And so, you, basically, patriotically dedicated your time, for free, helping us make contact and kind of coordinate some of those witnesses. (That was an awesome thing for Corbell and Knapp to do and it was for a great cause. The truth!) Burlison: "And I had been told Lacatski is probably not gonna reveal anything that he hasn't already revealed. When I've talked to people, it seemed like it wasn't gonna be new information. And therefore, to me, he wasn't as high of a priority." (He should have been THE priority, as far as witnesses for the hearing. With Lacatski, you have a respected rocket scientist, physicist and intelligence analyst, who has confirmed that this passage from Initial Revelations is accurate: “At the conclusion of a 2011 meeting in the Capitol building with a U.S. Senator and an agency Under Secretary, Lacatski, the only one of this book’s authors present, posed a question. He stated that the United States was in possession of a craft of unknown origin and had successfully gained access to its interior. This craft had a streamlined configuration suitable for aerodynamic flight but no intakes, exhaust, wings, or control surfaces. In fact, it appeared not to have an engine, fuel tanks, or fuel. Lacatski asked: What was the purpose of this craft? Was it a life-support craft useful only for atmospheric reentry or what? If it was a spacecraft, then how did it operate”? And, Lacatski may have seen the craft with his own eyes and entered it. But Burlison (or anybody else on the Task Force) didn't see it as a priority to bring him in, UNDER OATH, and have him repeat what is said in that book, and other important claims from the other two books, and his interviews with Knapp and Corbell? I'm shaking my head as I type this. You know what percentage of the world has read those books and/or watched the, limited, interviews Lacatski has given? Maybe 0.0000000000001% of the population? You had (and still do) a chance to get that man under oath and it wasn't a priority? WTAF? He's getting older and we don't know how much longer he will be around. If, as Rep. Andy Ogles told Matt Laslo, another hearing is coming in January, Lacatski, if he agrees, MUST be part of that. You can ask him about the craft, the alleged paranormal connection, and people getting sick and injured if they get too close to a UAP. And, he can be asked about the hitchhiker effect and claims of contagion. It doesn't matter if he won't add anything new or different than what's in his books or interviews. Put him under oath for the world to see and hear and, hopefully, the mainstream media picks up the story: Rocket Scientist: The USG Has an Otherworldly Craft in its Possession and Have Breached the Hull And maybe, if he's in a Disclosure mood, he'll offer up some surprise like he did in his last interview on Weaponized when he said we have made progress on back engineering these craft but, "it hasn't been achieved to its full extent." That's a MASSIVE claim! Push him to offer up more. And if his answers to many questions are: "It's all in my book"? Make him read from his book so the world can be informed about his claims and what was allegedly discovered in AAWSAP. David Grusch didn't say much more than what he said in his interview with Ross Coulthart and article in The Debrief, but was there ever any thought that he shouldn't have been put under oath and brought in as a witness for that congressional hearing? Of course not!) Burlison: "But to your point, I think getting him in a SCIF and seeing if there's maybe any additional room for him to talk, it might be worthwhile to do that." Knapp: "I think he might. I mean, the last conversations that we've had, it seems like he's edging closer to the idea that, under the right circumstances, he would be willing to share information with Congress, which would be great." (Again, I'm all for putting him the SCIF, too.)](https://image.24vids.com/tw-1999618259063308336/amplify_video_thumb/1999591424954957824/img/RtJss2MFC_SNRr-Z.jpg)
![I added a lot to this transcript and I'm not happy right now.. A Non-Human Intelligence on this Planet? "We're not aware of anything along that line that's ever been hidden from Congress" ~Rounds "I really don't believe that that is necessarily what's happened here." ~Rounds "We haven't seen that yet. It's not something that any of us have been able to, that I've been able to identify. I'm not aware of any of it." ~Rounds ~ Ross Coulthart: "If it turns out that, for example, the United States has recovered, incredibly, non-human technology, perhaps even craft and bodies, biologics, as some people assert. If that's true, and that has not been properly disclosed to Congress, and yet, by all accounts, billions, perhaps trillions of dollars have been expended on such a program, do you see any reason why on national security grounds that ought not to be disclosed to the public? That's the key issue. I mean, are you guys gonna cave at the last minute and say, 'Well, if we do have a flying saucer in a cave, it should not be revealed to the public for national security reasons.' Can you see any reason why that wouldn't be allowed to be revealed?" (That is THE question. Like I said the other day, Ross asks good questions and this is the one I really wanted him to ask.) Rounds: "Well, there are two items here. You do have a hypothetical. We're not aware of anything along that line that's ever been hidden from Congress, directly that we're aware of." (Have any witnesses made that claim? If so, how many? Look at how different Marco Rubio responded during his interview with Joe Khalil. Rubio: "Either, what [Grusch] is saying is partially true or entirely true, or...we have some really smart, educated people with high clearances and very important positions in our government, who are crazy, and are leading us on a goose chase." ~Senator Marco Rubio Full interview transcript: (What does Rounds think about Grusch or the other folks Grusch says have gone to the IG and who allegedly have hands-on experience with these NHI craft? Has Rounds heard form them?) ~ Rounds: "Also, the second part of it is, is we don't know if there was something out there, was it actually disclosed to some members of Congress who have continued to keep it quiet based upon their concerns about the release? We don't know it." (In 2002, Admiral Wilson told Dr. Eric Davis that politicians were NOT on the list of folks who were read in, or given access, to the alleged crash retrieval program. If that has changed, and certain members of Congress HAVE been read in, that doesn't change the fact that THE WORLD DESERVES TO KNOW if we share this planet with another intelligence. Stop using the, "It might be our tech" excuse.) Rounds: "So it really is a series of hypotheticals that you're asking me." (We all know that. That's why Ross phrased the question like that.) Rounds: "But let me continue on, because I think really, if I could put it in a simpler way... Let's just say that there had been a meeting or a contact with something that we didn't believe was from this world. Whether, you know, from another country, or from our own resources. At that point, you know, I think there's gonna come a time here in which the American public and people from around the world are gonna look at it and say, 'You know, it really would be crazy for us to believe that we really were alone in the world, or in the Universe, and that there is no other intelligent life form out there." (If what we're dealing with are extraterrestrials from another planet, I agree that the masses could say, "No shit! Not a surprise!' But what if it's something that doesn't have a physical body? As George Knapp has asked : What if they can see us but we can't see them, and they can watch us when we're in the bathroom or taking a shower? How would people handle that? Or, if they're time travelers from our future, back here to save us from some sort of cataclysm? Would that cause panic? Or, even if they were "just" extraterrestrials. Would people be able to handle Reptilians who might find human meat a delicacy, or Mantid beings who look like giant bugs? As Christopher K. Mellon said in 2015: "John Podesta said publicly, the American people can handle the truth. My question would be…if you don’t know what the truth is, how do you know they can handle it? What if they’re flesh-eating arachnids or something? Doesn’t seem to make sense to me” ~Mellon ~ Rounds: "But it would be a matter of how you would disclose it correctly, and in what would be one of the greatest announcements in the history of mankind, that we are not alone." (Is it the job of politicians or governments to withhold information until they figure out the proper way to disclose it? What if the information is scary and could cause panic? Would any government have a right to withhold that information from the people? I say, hell no.) Rounds: "I really don't believe that that is necessarily what's happened here. But, we do know - and this is the part that is so sensitive to us - there are some things that we can't explain out there." (Seems like we're back to square one. Holy shit.) Rounds "And that's the reason why I really got involved in this in the first place, is, if we know that there are technologies there that appear to do things that physically, we're just not sure how it's getting done. Biggest concern I had was, is it ours? Or does it belong to somebody else on this earth, one of our adversaries? Or is it really something that is out of this world? But in any of those events, two of the three would be very serious if we disclosed it to the American public because it would mean national defense issues are being broached. And that would be, it would be one of our adversaries' capabilities, or one of our own capabilities." (In other words, it may appear to be a technology from a non-human intelligence but we have to make triple sure it's not from an adversary or our own tech!!! There's always that chance! OMG! It seems like that will always be the excuse for not disclosing.) Rounds: "The third alternative, which I wouldn't be afraid of seeing some day... (Some day? That sounds far away. When? 2040? 2050?) Rounds: "But it can't. It can't. We haven't seen that yet. It's not something that any of us have been able to, that I've been able to identify. I'm not aware of any of it. But I know that there are things that we don't know how to identify today. Does that help?" (We've known that for a long time.) Ross: "It does, sir, it does." (It doesn't really help.)](https://image.24vids.com/tw-1939860994362417670/amplify_video_thumb/1939849275040473088/img/qMDMdsC4F-7B-RSa.jpg)