UBAI > UBI...what a concept from Emad

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@EMostaque Such an important conversation.

@EMostaque This is nonsense. It's the same kind of logic that would insist during the Great Depression that because everyone was poor, we had no tax money to do anything about the problem. Please consider reading this, and if you want to chat sometime, let's chat.

@EMostaque @scottsantens would be the best person to explain why UBI can work and is a good idea. I’m all for a completely new post-labor economy, but I don’t think we can get to that in time to avoid widespread economic hardship due to automation without cash payments like during Covid.

@EMostaque Universal Basic Income will never work when it is built on a debt based monetary system. Universal Basic Assets WILL work when it is built on a wealth based monetary system.

@EMostaque Why does this have to involve AI?

UBI works now during this transition. Emad's brilliant concept will not even be launched for a year and then will take time to reach scale. I agree 100% with his thesis however we can make the transition smoother by implementing a UBI today. Trust is the currency of the future. The Denver Basic Income Project (@denverbip) established a high level of trust with people experience homelessness in Denver in months, not years. It is robost and it works. It improves civic engagement. It saves lives today. It doesn't have to work forever. It needs to work now.

Of course UBI can't work ...the government is head over heels in debt Where is the money supposed to come from ? Yes it could work in one scenario: Forget money and capitalism and give all control to a central government, that simply sets prices on everything and issues credits to everyone ...just like in star trek, etc Problem is : nobody wants this

@EMostaque tax base won't go away. they will always come up with new ways to collect

@EMostaque Questionable... UBI is merely stabilizing income so aggregate demand doesn't go down. People's desire to spend doesn't change. Fear leads to precautionary saving, but UBI alleviates this fear much more than system overhaul would, because the economics of it is more predictable.

@EMostaque And as soon as I displease the government they take money out of my account or freeze it and I’m screwed.

@EMostaque UBI is mathematically fine. UBI > UBAI because it feeds people and pays the rent

@EMostaque maybe not in the US but for sure it will work in Denmark - we already have something like it.

@EMostaque I need to understand this more. This is intriguing.

@EMostaque Ehh. Just a reconstruction of socialism and total government control.

@EMostaque This doesn't work. We're entering an era of Post-Labor. There's nothing anyone can contribute that can beat out coming AI. This just becomes a winner takes all situation for whomever has access to the most advanced model. We're going to have to move past the idea of "money".

@EMostaque Very interesting concept. If we apply game theory, this may actually work. Yet, we would need to ensure the implementation creates equal opportunity for everyone. It must avoid empowering bad actors (read politicians) and disenfranchising people who choose a path less traveled.

@EMostaque so smart , in germany they invented the MINUTO , 1minuto is worth 1 minute of human labour and can be minted by humans and spent to each other

@EMostaque Think outside the box: forget finance and "wealth". e.g. AI should give each person what they need, and if there's anything left over, give equal amounts of what people "want". #future

@EMostaque that sounds like a job for crypto !

@EMostaque Smart people who enjoy inequality and believe poverty is good.

@EMostaque He's correct that if AI works at all it will allow owners to avoid taxes.

But we are one or two breakthroughs away from creating a safe way to achieve this. I keep thinking about the same problem. I think I'll figure it out. The thing is that elites now don't want AI if they cannot control it and cannot control people, so probably they'll eventually destroy it mutually but the thing is humans/me/everyone cannot solve problems unless we experience it. We cannot imagine problems and then figure out problems and then if it doesn't work, it doesn't mean we should destroy new innovations. We just have to keep observing and understanding and solving it, without experiencing it in the real world we'll not understand how to solve it. So we will have to let things happen and solve things as the problems arrive instead of predicting loss and destroying it.

@EMostaque Yes UBI won’t work, because humans will stop learning and evolving; however Agents will need to pay taxes - if we are operating under the assumptions that agents are the new employees and everyone will have swarms of agents.

@EMostaque @grok "profit is an indication they cant find marginal value" what is your interpretation here, and what is most likely to happen in a post labor economics situation where digital and physical labour are mostly automated

@EMostaque To me that sounds like almost the same as UBI. Instead of money you distribute something else. How is that make a fundamental difference? There is a major issue with capitalism, and even with the AI out of equation, the capitalism is a system that inevitably leads to collapse.

@EMostaque How will this even work 🤔🤔

@EMostaque Why aren't we taxing the companies replacing the workers with AI and robotics at the dollar replacement rate of a human worker??

@EMostaque Why would the AI accept human-created inflationary tokens to serve as money?

@EMostaque wtf is this guy talking about

@EMostaque The AI will make the paperclips and we sell the paperclips… #AI #Philosophy #UniversalPaperclips

@EMostaque Interesting.

@EMostaque We do not need a new version of Bitcoin. The existing system will do what you want it to do.

@EMostaque @grok do you agree? If yes why? If there is no jobs for 30% of the population then how do they survive if there is no UBI?

@EMostaque You have to give people Ai like you would give them education.